SRL Archive - Senior News and General

Someone asked about black market in The Dump, and HayHay thought if there could be one, but only for SRL Members and above.

The idea has been rejected before, I know why, but maybe we can get around the problem of scamming, and scammers becoming attracted.

It would be something new, I've though of some ideas, pros and cons also.

• Any members of the part of the community that would be accessible to the black market, SRL Members and up, could work as middlemen, themselves deciding wether or not want payment for it.
• Both succesful and not scamming would result in a permanent ban.
• Direct trades, without a middleman, would be defined as dangerous and non-recommended, though using your own sence is good, e.g I don't think Fawki'd care about free gp.
• Generally, have a sticky which reminds of what is safe and not, also that should include not to do trades, or atleast direct trades with members that have been here only a month or less.
• Posting pictures of a possible being sold account, including the two standard ones that are the login screen, stats, and then possibly inventory, bank or quest depending of what type of an account is being sold, would be required, otherwise resulting in closing of the thread.

The best protection is using your own sense, if a person feels untrustable, if you feel that he might recover the account back, or if it was a direct trade and he wants first and you feel that he is untrustable, do not trade!


Pros

• Safe and friendly black market

Cons

• Possibly attract scammers that would take advantage of the safe feeling, and even learn scripting to access the black market by becoming a member.

I thought I'd have more to say, but I guess I'll leave it up to you then :)

Post your thoughts.




Okay, above was more like of a RuneScape section, now here I'll stack the ideas of script sales, thank you Rasta :)


I'd say if we have a RuneScape Black Market we can have Script Sales too.

• Sections of verified and unverified pay scripts.
• A thread of a pay script needs to contain information of
• Very accurate information of what the buyer wants and needs to know, to buyer, same as with accounts, if the script doesn't feel like what you wan't, you think it's fishy or something, don't trade!
• It's cost. (e.g 5$, used in next step)
• Does it cost the 5$ in a month, week, e.g, or do you fully own your copy after one payment.

Keep suggesting…

sounds good to me, i'd say let's give it a try. and let's not tell the public we can actually black market in srl members, that'll keep the outside scammers away. i don't really think there would be any scams inside srl members, cus many people have lent their accounts to other scripters before with generally no problems.

i would even include script selling in there ;)

~RM

I'm all for it, but see here…http://www.villavu.com/forum/showthread.php?t=17486?t=19161

Thank you Claw :)

Even though Fakawi makes a valid point there, I think the points I gathered up there are enough for a discussion beyond the expectations of what could happen.

As I stated before, using your brains is what keeps you safe, for example if I was selling 20M, 2.5$ ea, I would only use as a middleman a member of the community that has more at stake than the 20M, and try to make an agreement with both the buyer and middleman that the buyer would get the 20M after I have the 50$ safely 'in my pocket'.

Well I didnt read your post, or the other posts in this thread, but you're probably right :)

It's against SRL's philosophy, but I'm all in, if it has a firecape section :f:
Oh, and only verified payscripts, which can't be shit (i.e. Nauman's Guildminer is/was pretty shit, we can't sell stuff like that).
And keep it SRL Members+ only? Public will only attract even more scammers.

From: Markus
Oh, and only verified payscripts, which can't be shit (i.e. Nauman's Guildminer is/was pretty shit, we can't sell stuff like that).

yes, and there is a way to stop bad scripts,

the forum staff charge some kind of "rent" for having a thread advertising it,

its not for our own greed, but the idea is, good scripts get purchased a lot, but no-one buys bad scripts, and they eventually go "out of business", and we removed the thread,

so good scripts tend to stay in the Script Selling section, while bad scripts perish,
its natural selection at work :)


the rent is a fixed-rate thing, you are basically paying for your thread to be in the Script Selling section, and the cost of this also depends on how much your script is,
so if your script costs 900k, you get charged 2000k per week,
if its 200k, you get 500k,

i would think its roughly equivalent that a script seller needs to sell two-and-a-half scripts a week (or month) to break even,

would it be two-and-a-half scripts? i dont know how active it would be…. maybe it will end up being only half a script per week


without this rent system, someone could write an incredibly bad script, and set up a thread for it, what do they care? it costs them nothing to have the thread,







although I'm quite against selling stuff like this at SRL, but you really must have it, then perhaps implement a rent system like this one to weed out bad scripts,

and if you do have it, make it clear to people why they are paying, they could cry "SRL wants to make a quick buck!!", you would have to explain to them the idea, and the system of two-and-a-half sales per week, and how it would weed out bad scripts

Thank you Yakman :)

Though 2m per week is maybe a bit too big :p

Oh, and only verified payscripts, which can't be shit (i.e. Nauman's Guildminer is/was pretty shit, we can't sell stuff like that).
And keep it SRL Members+ only? Public will only attract even more scammers.

Yes, SRL Members and above is what would make it possible :)


Hm, I'm glad I actually made a succesful thread about this :p



Also Yakman, I agree with that script sales is harder to 'host' than RuneScape blackmarket, if we find too much problems from it in this thread maybe we can continue improving the idea of a RuneScape blackmarket :)

I think this is a good idea. I personally am looking into selling my account:redface: , but I can't find a trustworthy place where I can sell it. This would be the perfect opportunity. Also, if scamming starts to happen, we could always get rid of the forum…

From: Yakman
yes, and there is a way to stop bad scripts,

the forum staff charge some kind of "rent" for having a thread advertising it,

its not for our own greed, but the idea is, good scripts get purchased a lot, but no-one buys bad scripts, and they eventually go "out of business", and we removed the thread,

so good scripts tend to stay in the Script Selling section, while bad scripts perish,
its natural selection at work :)


the rent is a fixed-rate thing, you are basically paying for your thread to be in the Script Selling section, and the cost of this also depends on how much your script is,
so if your script costs 900k, you get charged 2000k per week,
if its 200k, you get 500k,

i would think its roughly equivalent that a script seller needs to sell two-and-a-half scripts a week (or month) to break even,

would it be two-and-a-half scripts? i dont know how active it would be…. maybe it will end up being only half a script per week


without this rent system, someone could write an incredibly bad script, and set up a thread for it, what do they care? it costs them nothing to have the thread,







although I'm quite against selling stuff like this at SRL, but you really must have it, then perhaps implement a rent system like this one to weed out bad scripts,

and if you do have it, make it clear to people why they are paying, they could cry "SRL wants to make a quick buck!!", you would have to explain to them the idea, and the system of two-and-a-half sales per week, and how it would weed out bad scripts

i don't like the idea of paying to sell my script much, but i think yakman does have a point.

script approvals for quality may be said to be 'biased' and how good does a script have to be? for a script to be approved all it needs is to be safe, as in no sending of passwords to any third person.

~RM

script approvals for quality may be said to be 'biased' and how good does a script have to be? for a script to be approved all it needs is to be safe, as in no sending of passwords to any third person.

You make a valid point there, you usually can know the quality from the author.

Also, to send passwords to a 3rd party, SCAR will ask permission to connect to the site, unless you have SCAR's firewall on Allow All.

I don't really want this to turn into the next Sythe.org but if the selling is kept to SRL Members + it wouldn't be too bad.

From: n3ss3s
You make a valid point there, you usually can know the quality from the author.

Also, to send passwords to a 3rd party, SCAR will ask permission to connect to the site, unless you have SCAR's firewall on Allow All.

it has to connect to a third website to check for auth, and maybe send proggie etc. user wouldn't know what it's sending.

~RM

it has to connect to a third website to check for auth, and maybe send proggie etc. user wouldn't know what it's sending.

True, question of trustability once again, once again, as I said, using own brains will save you.

and to add to that trust thing, starblaster just made a really nice release ;)

http://www.villavu.com/forum/showthread.php?t=32038

couldn't have timed it better… or perhaps he read this thread :p

~RM

I support fully. Would bring some more life to the site.

It'd be great if we could set up some sort of credit system that would allow you to buy and sell with virtual dollars rather than paypal, but it'd also take a lot of work to build.

RSCA uses some kind of iCredits…

This seems good, only positive things being brought up :)

Few possible problems I see with credits, such as site crashes, hacking, and $ <-> credits conversions, but I really think they'd be good; it'd give anyone - not just those with paypal - reason to sell scripts / macro accounts to high levels.

From: n3ss3s
RSCA uses some kind of iCredits…

This seems good, only positive things being brought up :)

that's a good idea. A small percentage of what you buy in credits could go to srl, and everyone is happy :)

If you're gonna have the dump, why not make it efficient?

With those credits you can essentially remove paypal scamming, I'm all in favour of them.

Why would someone want to sell their script for "virtual dollars" rather than for real dollars?

People who want to buy scripts buy credits from Dankness.

They then trade credits with the script author for the script.

The script author then sells his credits back to Dankness, and gains money out of it. Dankness takes a small profit each time.

The only problem then is that Dankness can get scammed from people buying virtual credits, and he would have to be much more active.

If we give someone virtual credits, and he scams us, we can just delete the virtual credits? ;) Not that the transaction claim will be accepted, as we can proof to Paypal we gave him the credits. And Dankness doesn't have to do it, someone else can do it too.

Sounds like a nice idea, but alot of effort and Dankness wouldn't want to be a middle man all the time I'm guessing, since hes hardly ever here. Why dont we just let everyone use paypal? If theres proof of a scam then we just ban the user who scammed, and if we keep it srl members only (or even junior members only) I doubt they would want to risk getting banned for something like $5-$15. And if we get alot of scammers we could just make it than an MM is needed, everyone SSRL + could MM and would do the paypal file a claim then withdraw it trick.

And how about instead of charging rent, we charge a cut of the scripts sales? Like 5-10%. We could make it a rule that every script has to be authed via starblaster's setup, so that way if any script is sold star can easily see by going into his admin panel on his site, and then he can charge the script author's weekly or their scripts get removed.

IMO, if we have to get to the stage where we need Middle Men, the whole system should be scrapped.

My original idea for my auth system was to charge people depending on how many auths they want to add. So say they get to add 5 auths for free. They then have to pay an extra $5 to be able to add another 5 auths, and then another $5 to be able to add another 5 auths etc. Would be very easy to implement atm.

I think we need Fakawi, Dankness, possibly Wizzup input now.

EDIT: Oh and just so you know, the file a claim trick and withdraw it doesn't always work. If the members account is linked up to a card (which most of them are) they can call up the card company and tell them to cancel the transaction. I think you can do the same if you call up the bank actually.

Ah ok, but still, I doubt people would do that just to scam someone of $10 or so. Especially if it meant they would be banned

I am in favor of it.

I think its long overdue actually.

IMO, if we have to get to the stage where we need Middle Men, the whole system should be scrapped.

Although I think SSRL and up should be 'official middlemen', that can be asked if they want to be middlemen for a trade, because there is no way that every SRL Member would trust each other in bigger kind of trades, e.g worth 50$ and up.


I don't think we need a system like credits or something, people who scam get banned, simple enough, in my opinion…

mmm

Personally, I'm all for the script sales as they would be very cheap, but not for Pins, accounts etc. as we can be talking about a lot of money there.

I don't really like the idea of a black market at all, it can only cause problems. But if there has to come one, I'm with Star, it'll have to be scripts only.

It's a hard topic to discuss whether or not to have account, pin and gold sales, since most of the safety depends of the buyer and seller.

People can avoid getting scammed big moneys buy not putting big moneys into it.

If someone wants to buy 10 mills which'd be around 50$, he could buy them in stacks of two making the amount of possible loss only 10$.

Charge backs can be done up to 30 days later. If a buyer wants 10 million i doubt the seller is going to have the patience to sell 10 mill to him over a period of 30 days. Then he would have to wait another 30 to guarantee that no charge backs occur.

I have had every trick pulled on me whilst selling scripts with paypal. I know what I'm talking about.

And yes, you can do multiple charge backs within one month, just tell your bank that someone is using your card and they will cancel all transactions. I lost over £200 in one go by someone doing that to me whilst selling mills. (Did charge back trick, traded in steps etc.)

In SSRL, we all trust eachother, at least to the point where we aren't afraid of scamming. Hence, SSRL should have a blackmarket to sell whatever they like.

SRL members aren't as trusted, but surely they can handle smaller amounts of cash. Give them a market for scripts, and if, for a month or two, all is well, give them a bit more freedom.

EDIT: n3ss3s: only 3 more posts until your 1337 post ;)

I have had every trick pulled on me whilst selling scripts with paypal. I know what I'm talking about.

No doubt, how about Smartzkid's idea? :)

Im pretty sure you CANT chargeback if you select goods? Correct me if im wrong. You cant chargeback instantly on a tangible good. It has to go through the dispute process. Plus alot of people are verified now anyway.

Although i dont want to devalue SRL members. I would rather a small forum was created for SSRL. Although we dont have that many here. I have no problem with just one board for people selling odd bits here and hter.e

Dev+:
-Create and maintain scripts to sell to members. Since they're devs, you can trust that they're good scripts.
-Scripts would be encrypted by Freddy (or Ben, if Freddy's not around), and be authed (duh..) - if scamming took place, the stealer could be de-authed.
-All sellers' paypals would have to be verified.

Maybe a few devs (+ SSRL?) would be interested in creating a script to maintain as a group and sell as donations to SRL?


SSRL:
-Private board for buying/selling/trading accounts, pins, maybe even some rl stuff.

I say no. I'm not worried about scamming or anything I just don't see the point. If I quit, I would simply give away my accounts, I don't see a need to sell them.

If someone does a trade big enough to be scamworthy, he most likely is doing it with a person that is trustable.

How about "we" create a new, seperate site with a black market ran by a few high-ranked people from here?

AKA: Sp0rk-eh.com?

Except for the fail part sp0rk-eh.com has.

Mebbz if we reanimate using a legal bulletin such as phbb, rather than an illegal, probably outdated version of vB, we could bring some life into it?

Let's get something done, could we atleast add a Script Sales Advertises forums for all public, which are only Advertising / Discussion threads?

I'm trying to make some kind of a pay script and I really don't want to just have a link to Sythe in my sig :(

From: n3ss3s
Let's get something done, could we atleast add a Script Sales Advertises forums for all public, which are only Advertising / Discussion threads?

I'm trying to make some kind of a pay script and I really don't want to just have a link to Sythe in my sig :(

In the beginning I thought there was a reason script sales weren't allowed on this forum.

This all needs polling.

Polls:
-Members script market
-SSRL Market (SSRL+; sell anything to other SSRL members)
-Dev script sales (Dev+; sell scripts to everyone)
-Pin sales (1 or 2 trusted people, part of profits go to srl?)

I'll make a new thread.