SRL Archive - News and General

Possible Simba detection


Echo_

2013-01-25 01:02:49

Since this directly affects the SRL community:

http://www.moparisthebest.com/smf/index.php/topic,597618.msg4207201.html

So, there's a function in jaclib.dll that is named as if it is some sort of wrapper around ping. Currently it's exported as __stdcall Java_jaclib_ping_IcmpService_run.

But, it does some things that are very much not as it's named.

Firstly, it does some JNI stuff to get a handle to a function named 'notify' in the client with signature (I)V. Then it installs a message hook to all windows capturing low level mouse events and sits in a loop plucking messages:
v5 = SetWindowsHookExA(14, fn, hmod, 0);
/* some stuff /*
while ( GetMessageA(&Msg, 0, 0, 0) )
{
TranslateMessage(&Msg);
DispatchMessageA(&Msg);
}
UnhookWindowsHookEx(hhk);
The messages go to a callback that basically just calls the notify function mentioned earlier with the only interesting parameter being a pointer into the MSLLHOOKSTRUCT Windows gives you with that message.

I know I'm not the first to discover this (well, I found it ages ago actually, so I might have been, but I know others know about it now since if you google the method there is a pastebin result) but what I don't know is what its for.

MSLLHOOKSTRUCT contains some innocuous data like the point info, but more importantly it contains the LLMHF_INJECTED flag, which if set = this event was artificially created using SendInput or similar rather than through hardware. This makes this function a potential Simba/RiD trap, no?

If it is, though, why haven't they been using it? Does anyone with more intimate knowledge of the client know what the notify method does?

It's perhaps possible that they use this just for input on their Window I guess, but why hook all windows (they have the handle at this point) and why name it as if its something its not?


tl;dr It is possible that Jagex can detect Simba by checking if your mouse movements and clicks are actually coming from your mouse, or a mouse emulated with software.

Le Jingle

2013-01-25 01:35:29

Simba is single threaded, no? Haven't seen anything happen thus far due to this, could try thread encryption (AESCrypt - single thread encryption) to protect or is it still read? Tbh too newbs to know any more

Nice find
-Lj

Flight

2013-01-25 01:36:33

There was discussion about this before, I believe from the SCAR forums. In the end, if I understand correctly, Ben pointed out this was only possible this was only possible through RS's Fullscreen mode.

Read about it here:
http://villavu.com/forum/showthread.php?t=85688

Echo_

2013-01-25 02:30:36

Didn't even see that thread before lol

I'm still skeptical.

weequ

2013-01-25 02:48:44

I think they are moving their client from java to HTML5 this year and I'm wondering what kind of access they can have to our computers using javascript?

Justin

2013-01-25 03:06:08

Thanks for posting this

CynicRus

2013-01-25 03:33:46

It's all nonsense. I think.

Benny

2013-01-25 05:45:38

I think there would be more bans if this is the case? Correct me if I am wrong.

Kevin

2013-01-25 10:55:57

As many privileges as would have to be set to allow a program to access this information (especially a browser program, that concept blows my mind as even remotely possible), I believe it's actually against the law in most countries to install that type of monitoring onto anyone's computer without explicit permission.

But then again, when's the last time someone read the Terms of Agreement…

Sjoe

2013-01-25 11:02:00

From: nivek1989


But then again, when's the last time someone read the Terms of Agreement…


Bruce Willis?
(I felt the need to go Off-topic)

Kevin

2013-01-25 11:28:40

From: Sjoekeloe
Bruce Willis?
(I felt the need to go Off-topic)


New Die Hard movie? (Haven't seen it yet)

Sjoe

2013-01-25 11:33:59

From: nivek1989
New Die Hard movie? (Haven't seen it yet)


Lool , no, He read the entire Itunes Terms of agreement.
Was gonna sue them, but didn't eventually.

Kevin

2013-01-25 11:47:50

From: Sjoekeloe
Lool , no, He read the entire Itunes Terms of agreement.
Was gonna sue them, but didn't eventually.


I was worried for a minute that somehow a giant portion of the plot was based around an evil ToA lol.

Ian

2013-01-25 12:04:54

From: -Benny
I think there would be more bans if this is the case? Correct me if I am wrong.


Unless… they are waiting to ban us all at once to make a show of it? :unsure:

Could be some stuff that's just being worked on or abandoned and someone forgot to remove it too.

Benny

2013-01-25 13:15:09

From: BMWxi
Unless… they are waiting to ban us all at once to make a show of it? :unsure:

Could be some stuff that's just being worked on or abandoned and someone forgot to remove it too.


Well sir, lets hope not because that would suck on a next level. Should probably let this thread die so Jagex aren't alerted :p

Kyle Undefined

2013-01-25 14:14:29

@BraK; make yourself useful and move to Members section, pl0x. :)

<3

grats

2013-01-25 14:32:08

From: Le Jingle
Simba is single threaded, no? Haven't seen anything happen thus far due to this, could try thread encryption (AESCrypt - single thread encryption) to protect or is it still read? Tbh too newbs to know any more

Nice find
-Lj


sure, but smart has many threads

From: weequ
I think they are moving their client from java to HTML5 this year and I'm wondering what kind of access they can have to our computers using javascript?


nothing using just javascript, html5 could log stuff clientside and then they may be able to pull stuff from that… they also said all their server side is staying java, still.

Jake

2013-01-25 16:16:09

From: Flight
There was discussion about this before, I believe from the SCAR forums. In the end, if I understand correctly, Ben pointed out this was only possible this was only possible through RS's Fullscreen mode.

Read about it here:
http://villavu.com/forum/showthread.php?t=85688

I remember making that thread.. Accidentally caused so many people to be afraid of using the program, and there will still those who were afraid after Benland posted :P

Echo_

2013-01-25 20:15:03

From: nivek1989
As many privileges as would have to be set to allow a program to access this information (especially a browser program, that concept blows my mind as even remotely possible), I believe it's actually against the law in most countries to install that type of monitoring onto anyone's computer without explicit permission.

But then again, when's the last time someone read the Terms of Agreement…


It doesn't even have to be in their TOS, you agree to let them do whatever they want (within the privileges given to Java applets) when agreeing to run the signed applet. And they no longer give you the option of running signed or unsigned.