SRL Archive - Bot Information and Spottings

It's almost been 1 year since the Snellman Brothers, owners and creators of Impulse Software, was successfully sued and shut down by Jagex Ltd.
They had to pay fees that were up to about $ 1,000,000 (1 million USdollars), hand over the information of bot users, developers, and all domains.

I was surprised that Jagex literally milked the two brothers for the smallest things. They began their claim with the court that the two brothers had "infringed skill icons such as crafting, mining, smithing, fishing, and other activities". Jagex brought up skill icons… to add into the rest of things they were suing the Snellman's for.. I thought that was kinda low..

I've wondered how that massive fine was paid.
Along with giving the payments from bot purchases over to jagex, I'm certain that the Snellman's had to sell their property and most likely move to a different location, or something along those lines.

More importantly, I guess we can say that the money that Jagex received, was used in a way which was not considered a "good way" to spend that money from the Snellman Brothers.

I was curious to see if the only known address of the Snellman Bro's was still being used, or if the house was even there.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/78898058/Jagex-vs-Impulse-Software-Agreement-for-Judgment
http://www.scribd.com/doc/78898058/Jagex-vs-Impulse-Software-Agreement-for-Judgment
So what do you think of what the life is like for the Snellman Brothers now?
What do you think Jagex used the money on?

thats crazy… i feel bad for the dudes.

Well Jagex isnt using that money well because we have heard about their employees.

Another example of why i have 0 respect for jagex these days

From: idodew
thats crazy… i feel bad for the dudes.

They were breaking the law, and massively degrading the game as a whole, which is probably one of the main reasons microtransactions came into the game.

Without causing too much offence, but the most negative comments about the game seem to come from communities who make their way not actually playing the game.

this is exactly why i never keep a dime in my bank account, if i was to get some sort of legal action against me they could freeze my accounts. but if i have a crap load of cash seize it if you can find me

From: Richard
They were breaking the law, and massively degrading the game as a whole, which is probably one of the main reasons microtransactions came into the game.

Without causing too much offence, but the most negative comments about the game seem to come from communities who make their way not actually playing the game.

But a million dollars? I think thats going overboard, although Im not sure how much they had in sales.
They also went in detail about how the skill icons were infringed by impsoft.

Lets say they received the full payment of more than a million dollars by now.
Would you think people would like the game back how it was before the lawsuit or how it is now? That would be debatable.

I didn't exactly love the guys, didn't want them to go down either. I think jagex could've used the money for something more productive, like setting up a new branch for higher analysis of the game on a statistical level.

~Rez

Jagex didn't actually tell the us the fee, they just said 5 digits.. think if it was actually 900k they would tell us, it was more like 100-200k tbh.

From: Ollybest
Jagex didn't actually tell the us the fee, they just said 5 digits.. think if it was actually 900k they would tell us, it was more like 100-200k tbh.

The court documents clearly state that Snellman brothers are required to pay 1 million dollars, before december 31st 2012.

Its on page 6 of this http://www.scribd.com/doc/78898058/Jagex-vs-Impulse-Software-Agreement-for-Judgment

Defendants shall be liable toJagex for payment of liquidated damages in the amount of $1,000,000 (U.S.). Such liquidated damages are intended to represent estimated actual damages, attorneys’ fees, andcosts, and are not intended as a penalty, and Defendants shall pay them to Jagex.

More information about their house

Defendants’ Second Payment to Jagex shall be secured by a lien onDefendants’ home located at 3012 Bellwind Circle, Rockledge, Florida 32955. The lienshall be for 200% of the amount of the Second Payment in order to cover any attorneys’ feesor costs incurred by Jagex in the event that it needs to execute on the lien due to non- payment by Defendants.

I heard the problem about Jagex is their senior management is completely disconnected from the lower tiers and don't know a thing about running a business.

My logic says this: their bots had an effect on the game therefore the effected the legit players of the game. So in my opinion, the money Jagex won from these guys should be used for a good cause that gives back to the players, no?

When actually, in the end, the players who had to put up with the swarms of bots receive a single "Apology Letter" from the Snellman brothers. At the very least, even just part of that money could have been used for true anti-bot software in Runescape, but all we've seen so far is a tighter obfuscated client, a few banned RWT'ers, and the ever-so-useless Bottany Bay.. Bots remain and the detection system has only degraded since then, especially with the removal of random events. Also, SoF and Soloman's Shop are now priority #1.

On a different note is it just me or…

Nice find Flight :D. And yeah, 1m could have gone a long way to stopping bots.

From: Flight

On a different note is it just me or…

But the fountain has been there for years. I think its just a coincidence… but i could be wrong. ;)

Lmao nice find Flight!

flight your such a sneaky devious person :O

hahahahaha flight nice.
IMO these brothers got what was coming to them, crime doesn't[shouldn't] pay. (ish)

obviously that's the new Research and Development center of Jagex.. hence the somewhat lacking SOF updates etc

From: cause
hahahahaha flight nice.
IMO these brothers got what was coming to them, crime doesn't[shouldn't] pay. (ish)

Depends what you consider to be crime, i have no idea how reflection worked because i never looked into it, but i think that the punishment was far to hardh for any copying of code that occured,

They made a client to click places on screen, you can do this on literaly any PC using windows in a few min, and they get such a fine?

Fair enough jagex think they ruin their game, but shut them down, dont ruin their lives too, If you make a game that requires this much grinding, and entirely click base it, guess what is going to happen…, people have been using autoclickers and such ever since the game was released, and will be doing it long after jagex dies,

Making an example of two people (or i suppose they tried to keep it secret with gag orders and such so they were just after the money?) is just silly imo

Random question… But what was it that these guys actually developed? I'm assuming it was one of the injection/reflection bots that went down back in the days. But which one was it?

From: P1ng
Random question… But what was it that these guys actually developed? I'm assuming it was one of the injection/reflection bots that went down back in the days. But which one was it?

Nexus/iBot which was one of the (arguably) biggest/best/widely used bots.
They also make a ton of money but selling auth codes for their scripts, and requiring additional auths to run additional instances.

Yohojo basically covered it all. They were creators of Impsoft, Impulse Software, which created the nexus client. They hired developers to create a script for every skill and mini game in rs.

All bots were premium, the free ones were bugged and useless.
They ran access to the script by using authentication codes. Each code cost around anywhere from $15 to $30, for just one instance (1 account).

These were amazing bots, able to run past 2 weeks of botting straight if there was a game update which wouldn't break the bot to be reviewed and fixed.

Some developers for Impsoft moved to script for powerbot.
The cost of the bot was expensive one can say, but it was for sure worth it.

There also was legitresellers of those auths, such as RSBots.net and so forth.
They also had a huge player base

Personally, I doubt 1m made that much of a dent into their profits, and if Jagex take into account the potential loss of revenue from legitimate players, it probably isn't too ridiculous.

Also, remember how much they lost from Stellar Dawn, I expect they're still recovering from that.

I know Jagex could be doing more to stop the bots, but the root of the problem is still in these large bot communities, the ones who fuel gold farming. Although if you go to previously very high botted areas, like sorceress's garden, there is not a bot in sight

From: Jakee
The court documents clearly state that Snellman brothers are required to pay 1 million dollars, before december 31st 2012.

Its on page 6 of this http://www.scribd.com/doc/78898058/Jagex-vs-Impulse-Software-Agreement-for-Judgment

Re-read the document carefully. Based on my knowledge through my connections, I think you guys are tossing around significantly higher numbers.

From: cause
hahahahaha flight nice.
IMO these brothers got what was coming to them, crime doesn't[shouldn't] pay. (ish)

They still got an education off it. I daresay, for them, it did pay.

To be perfectly honest I think they made more than 1 million USD with their scripts and client.

If they had a user base of like 200k people, each script averaging around $15..lets say each person bought two scripts.

6 million dollars, 4 million for script developers/taxes/random expenses… The rest should go to them.

My logic is probably very flawed but, meh.

But I thought the script developers would get a share too on the payments? Or did they get a set one time payment when they released their first script.

iirc devs got decent cuts. as for the snellman bros, i still see mark post on fb once in a while. so i guess he's still alive and kicking.

From: Rezozo
I didn't exactly love the guys, didn't want them to go down either. I think jagex could've used the money for something more productive, like setting up a new branch for higher analysis of the game on a statistical level.

~Rez

This. So much this. Their anti-bot technology is all fine and stuff, but it obviously does not work. I'm sure that if they hired some real mathematicians and set up an analytical system they could completely stop botting. At least with commonly used scripts (perhaps extremely well-written scripts used by single persons would still be applicable, but you get my point).

They had a very lucrative thing going, I do feel bad for the guys as they probably lost all of their belongings in the process…
But I am confident they will be able to raise themselves off the ground and start another tech company, maybe even more successful than the previous

I do have one question tough, how come they managed to bring them down but not Paris and his PowerBot?

From: speedster

I do have one question tough, how come they managed to bring them down but not Paris and his PowerBot?

Probably cuz they're money-hungry atm, so they're milking as much money as possible from botters. Hence them making a Yelps/Solomon update like every week.

They got a pretty dope house though seriously. That's got to be a mil by itself

From: bcutt
They got a pretty dope house though seriously. That's got to be a mil by itself

Most likely more than that, houses near my area are over 3 million, take addition of the land, etc

With that being in FL, and that area, couple million for that house.

PB has to be the largest source of bots for all players and gold farmers right now. Why isn't Jagex going after them for?

Pretty harsh if you ask me I guess it's back to living with mum for them.

From: Flight
My logic says this: their bots had an effect on the game therefore the effected the legit players of the game. So in my opinion, the money Jagex won from these guys should be used for a good cause that gives back to the players, no?

When actually, in the end, the players who had to put up with the swarms of bots receive a single "Apology Letter" from the Snellman brothers. At the very least, even just part of that money could have been used for true anti-bot software in Runescape, but all we've seen so far is a tighter obfuscated client, a few banned RWT'ers, and the ever-so-useless Bottany Bay.. Bots remain and the detection system has only degraded since then, especially with the removal of random events. Also, SoF and Soloman's Shop are now priority #1.

On a different note is it just me or…

LMFAO this is brilliant.

From: Rincewind
PB has to be the largest source of bots for all players and gold farmers right now. Why isn't Jagex going after them for?

They probably are working on it, just haven't given any word/comment yet to the public.

When RSBots.net was being sued, it wasn't completely announced by jagex, instead one of the users on the forums found a court case online that included IMPSOFT VS JAGEX.

He/she posted that thread with the law suit papers attached to it, and then came the rush and panic of a lot of botters and legit players.

http://www.rfcexpress.com/lawsuits/copyright-lawsuits/massachusetts-district-court/54191/jagex-limited-v-impulse-software-et-al/summary/

From: Four
They probably are working on it, just haven't given any word/comment yet to the public.

When RSBots.net was being sued, it wasn't completely announced by jagex, instead one of the users on the forums found a court case online that included IMPSOFT VS JAGEX.

I hear PB is developed / published from china? Someone said that here a while ago, the relations between UK/US and China are not the best, so it's unlikely any lawsuit would even reach them lol,

Impsoft was US/UK wasn't it?

From: DannyRS
I hear PB is developed / published from china? Someone said that here a while ago, the relations between UK/US and China are not the best, so it's unlikely any lawsuit would even reach them lol,

Impsoft was US/UK wasn't it?

The Snellman brothers were located in the United States

PB is Chinees that guy Paris is a chinees guy and Jagex cant do a fk about it

From: DannyRS
I hear PB is developed / published from china? Someone said that here a while ago, the relations between UK/US and China are not the best, so it's unlikely any lawsuit would even reach them lol,

Impsoft was US/UK wasn't it?

Impsoft was in US
PB is under J.P. Holdings Int’l Ltd (“JPH”),

a company registered in England and Wales under Company No. 07584150, whose registered office is Chancery Station House, 31-33 High Holborn, London WC1V 6AX, United Kingdom.

Nothing about china, they are just partners with gold4fun for market/business relations

Paris is Indian and lives in the UK AFAIK.

As Four said, the gold selling company they are affiliated with is Chinese.

Sometimes when you go onto the PB homepage, it says based in the US/UK in the upper right hand corner.


I'm just surprised Jagex is taking this long to take PB down. Just one quick glance at their forums and you see botting, RWT, and all the other things Jagex hates so much being carried about like normal business.

PB has been "taken down" By Jagex many times.

For instance, Paris can't load any Jagex made application or game anymore. (legally) So Paris can't actually work on the active client himself.

The rest of it, they use Loophole after Loophole to get through, making it more difficult for jagex to Totally take them down…

Example: WBot came out of no where, was up the fastest, but didn't use smart Legal practices and got taken down because of it within a month.

Im Assuming PB will take a LONG time to get back up after rs3…Even after the client is "ready", they have to make sure its legal enough to upload w/o getting immedtialty taken down.

From: Itankbots
PB has been "taken down" By Jagex many times.

For instance, Paris can't load any Jagex made application or game anymore. (legally) So Paris can't actually work on the active client himself.

The rest of it, they use Loophole after Loophole to get through, making it more difficult for jagex to Totally take them down…

Example: WBot came out of no where, was up the fastest, but didn't use smart Legal practices and got taken down because of it within a month.

Im Assuming PB will take a LONG time to get back up after rs3…Even after the client is "ready", they have to make sure its legal enough to upload w/o getting immedtialty taken down.

That's interesting. I'm only a year onto the botting scene, but did any of the previous big name bots like Nexus ever reach PB's size?

How where they caught? But yea, with the 1 million we have the better sound in rs3.

From: denart5
How where they caught? But yea, with the 1 million we have the better sound in rs3.

They were not really "caught" it's not like they were hiding out somewhere… Also this topic is over a month old

I really hope Pbot gets shutdown :p *finger crossed*

From: Sjoe
I really hope Pbot gets shutdown :p *finger crossed*

Why? So then somebody might actually use your chocolate crusher? :p :p

From: Officer Barbrady
Why? So then somebody might actually use your chocolate crusher? :p :p

Ouch :( Nah I had the users there.

From: Officer Barbrady
Why? So then somebody might actually use your chocolate crusher? :p :p

I'll have you know that his chocolate crusher is very good at crushing an inventory of chocolate :)

Scary stuff

i live 5minutes from rockleadge

From: went2thedrkside
i live 5minutes from rockleadge

should go to the address and take pics and post back here to us.

i will do that, always down for a lil recon mission

From: went2thedrkside
i will do that, always down for a lil recon mission

good luck trooper. And may the force be with you.

From: went2thedrkside
i will do that, always down for a lil recon mission

3 months have passed

What happened to went2thedrkside..
this forum may never know.

From: Four
3 months have passed

What happened to went2thedrkside..
this forum may never know.

RIP went2thedrkside

From: Four
3 months have passed

What happened to went2thedrkside..
this forum may never know.

Jagex got him :(

From: Four
3 months have passed

What happened to went2thedrkside..
this forum may never know.

From: went2thedrkside
i live 5minutes from rockleadge

-Got lost on the way over-

You may be the reason no one every sees went2thedrkside again, Four. :surprised:

From: Flight
-Got lost on the way over-

You may be the reason no one every sees went2thedrkside again, Four. :surprised:

Well he did go 2thedrkside ;)

I'm friend with the Snellman's on facebook, and theyre doing fine.

From: TronicRS
I'm friend with the Snellman's on facebook, and theyre doing fine.

Proof please + with an update

TBH if i was in jagex's position, would have probably done the same. I'm pretty damn sure 99% of the people here would have done too.

this thread is old but

even after the $1million sue the snellman brothers still made out with millions. not only did they collect something like 30-40% of ALL nexus script sales, but they also made bank off their OEM bot sales on rscheata.

but rsbots.net was probably their biggest source of revenue, collecting that 30-40% off every sale. iirc perfecticus's red chin hunter sold 10k scripts alone.

From: Nebula
this thread is old but

even after the $1million sue the snellman brothers still made out with millions. not only did they collect something like 30-40% of ALL nexus script sales, but they also made bank off their OEM bot sales on rscheata.

but rsbots.net was probably their biggest source of revenue, collecting that 30-40% off every sale. iirc perfecticus's red chin hunter sold 10k scripts alone.

They made more after placing that 1 auth = 1 account rule.

But then dumps of auths were going around, people began sharing auths.

https://www.facebook.com/mark.snellman
Seems fine here

They knew the risk, they deserved it, and they chose to keep doing what they were doing. If I was the head of Jagex, I'd find anyway to take down these scrubs..

From: VillaVuFTW
https://www.facebook.com/mark.snellman
Seems fine here

Is that really him?

From: Nebula
this thread is old but

even after the $1million sue the snellman brothers still made out with millions. not only did they collect something like 30-40% of ALL nexus script sales, but they also made bank off their OEM bot sales on rscheata.

but rsbots.net was probably their biggest source of revenue, collecting that 30-40% off every sale. iirc perfecticus's red chin hunter sold 10k scripts alone.

Wow that's crazy!

From: mocrosoft
Wow that's crazy!

You've just advanced a Gravedigging level!
Your Gravedigging level is now 99.