SRL Archive - Discussions and Debates

Pretty much, I'm sick of windows. Worse than that, I am currently running vista.

Lately I've been using macs very often, which seem to me to be far better than vista.
Also, vista has been eating up a whole f lot of CPU, making my computer crash at times.

Not having the money for a mac, I decided to look into Linux / Unix / GNU / Ubuntu.

What is everyone's advice, special features / advantages of switching, what to watch out for, etc?

Obviously I've been reading around on wiki. But I'd like to hear some opinions of the people who are actually using it :)

~RM

I was using Ubuntu 9.04, then switched to 9.10. To me it always seemed that things were usually rather "glitchy" on Ubuntu, and WINE really isn't all too great either IMO.

I run Tiny7 now and love it honestly. I still have Ubuntu 9.10 on my PC as well, though I haven't even used it once since Tiny7.

If you are looking into the linux epoch, I might suggest installing a Linux type on a thumb drive and booting to that for test running/driving.

Also, good idea to hear from peoples that actually use linux. Sometimes wikifail; usually good though.

From: anonymity
If you are looking into the linux epoch, I might suggest installing a Linux type on a thumb drive and booting to that for test running/driving.

Also, good idea to hear from peoples that actually use linux. Sometimes wikifail; usually good though.

Also, you can burn an Ubuntu Live CD right from the official Ubuntu site.

http://www.ubuntu.com/

I would recommend Ubuntu or Kubuntu (more windows-like).

Watch out for the learning curve. Its steep at times, but overall worth it.

The efficiency of Linux is ridiculous over windows, and quite frankly more stable.

Just my opinion, oh and be sure you have a good knowledge of googling.

I use xubuntu and like it, If you pick any of the ubuntus, if you install wine remember to check winehq and add it to your sources, the one in ubuntu's default sources is OLD…

*buntu sucks IMO, but it is probably best for you if you are coming from Windows. I would suggest xubuntu over ubuntu or kubuntu because it is very lightweight and has (in my opinion) a much better UI.
Another one to look at is lubuntu, which is, as far as I know, supposed to be released with ubuntu 10.04. It is more lightweight than xubuntu, so depending on how slow your computer is, it may be a better choice.

From: NCDS
I was using Ubuntu 9.04, then switched to 9.10. To me it always seemed that things were usually rather "glitchy" on Ubuntu, and WINE really isn't all too great either IMO.

I run Tiny7 now and love it honestly. I still have Ubuntu 9.10 on my PC as well, though I haven't even used it once since Tiny7.

Well, I don't think you should call Linux glitchy because you use Firefox + Flash in WINE. :p
I usually do it like this:
All day work on Ubuntu Linux.
Games: Wine (because it's native)
Special windows apps (simba,etc): VirtualBox / qemu.

Also check out LinuxMint. It's basically Ubuntu with a bunch of changes, many of which you will make on Ubuntu anyway.

I used Ubuntu 9.10, and I love it. The only time I ever use Windows is to play Steam games.

I recommend it for sure. I can't seem to get some things working properly on WINE, but virtual boxes are cool and easy to use.

From: Coh3n
I used Ubuntu 9.10, and I love it. The only time I ever use Windows is to play Steam games.

I recommend it for sure. I can't seem to get some things working properly on WINE, but virtual boxes are cool and easy to use.

Offtopic: Steam is coming to Linux. ( http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=ODE3Mw )

From: Boreas
Also check out LinuxMint. It's basically Ubuntu with a bunch of changes, many of which you will make on Ubuntu anyway.

Mint is just Ubuntu with even more bloat added.. :/

From: Harry
Mint is just Ubuntu with even more bloat added.. :/

IMO its the vista of linux.

From: Wizzup?
Offtopic: Steam is coming to Linux. ( http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=ODE3Mw )

Perfect, then once I can figure out a decent way to manage my iPod, I can get rid of windows for good. :)

I would use ubuntu if I could sync my ipod touch without ssh

@iPod people: tried amorak?

From: noidea
@iPod people: tried amorak?

From the 2nd gen iPod touch to any other ipod after, you can't update w/ anything but iTunes. (unless you ssh in etc.)

What about running iTunes in WINE?

http://store.steampowered.com/public/client/steam_client_linux

:V Fun, gonna see if I can get this running.

What about songbird @ linux people?

Dunno if it works, but I'm guessing youd always be able to run it on wine. Made by the same people as firefox, opensource, and you can just download an ipod pluggin. I currently use it (along with spotify) and love it.

~RM

From: Coh3n
Perfect, then once I can figure out a decent way to manage my iPod, I can get rid of windows for good. :)

I thought Rhythmbox was quite OK for managing iPods? I think I managed mine with it. Otherwise, try gtkpod.

E: AFAIK gtkPod can update too, http://www.gtkpod.org/about.html

From: Wizzup?
I thought Rhythmbox was quite OK for managing iPods? I think I managed mine with it. Otherwise, try gtkpod.

E: AFAIK gtkPod can update too, http://www.gtkpod.org/about.html

Doesn't work for models past the 2g touch…

@RM, songbird is awesome, but it has the same issue as others. Apple decided to do some encryption hence you can't update it.

From: Nava2
Doesn't work for models past the 2g touch…

Where does it state this?

From: Wizzup?
Where does it state this?

gtkpod doesn't even list iPod touch as supported. But it's more or less general knowledge among those of us coming fr recent windows with said products. Apple screwed other music players over.

Claw, iTunes does not work in wine haha. Not a chance.

From: Wizzup?
Well, I don't think you should call Linux glitchy because you use Firefox + Flash in WINE. :p
I usually do it like this:
All day work on Ubuntu Linux.
Games: Wine (because it's native)
Special windows apps (simba,etc): VirtualBox / qemu.

Your right, I shouldn't blame linux as many other people have most everything they need working with it.

I was rather impatient with the situation I suppose as I was trying to work on other thing's while setting up/adjusting to Ubuntu and just got aggravated with it.

I guess my overall advice is that Ubuntu is great, as long as your committed and have the time to learn your way around.

Little offtopic, but I think its funny.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sCzNXJv7tI8

[QUOTE=Camaro';704648]Little offtopic, but I think its funny.

[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sCzNXJv7tI8[/url][/QUOTE]

I laughed.

It is always a pain to find drivers for my computer on any linux distro. Ubuntu is the only one I could find that actually works.

Windows 7 is much better, it doesnt use as much cpu as vista so just upgrade to that

From: cycrosism
Windows 7 is much better, it doesnt use as much cpu as vista so just upgrade to that

Do you have any of the linux OSs to say so?

~RM

From: cycrosism
Windows 7 is much better, it doesnt use as much cpu as vista so just upgrade to that

I'd say Windows 7 probably uses less RAM than Vista, but I don't really think the CPU usage will differ a lot. You'll still need a Firewall, Virus Scanner, and lots of other bloat.

From: Wizzup?
I'd say Windows 7 probably uses less RAM than Vista, but I don't really think the CPU usage will differ a lot. You'll still need a Firewall, Virus Scanner, and lots of other bloat.

Do people generally not use Firewalls and Virus Scanners on linux?

~RM

From: Rasta Magician
Do people generally not use Firewalls and Virus Scanners on linux?

~RM

I've never felt the need to install either of them.. ;)
But I guess you can say Ubuntu comes with a firewall installed, but a proper one. But by default ports that you open, are just open…

I've been using Windows for 7 or so years, without an antivirus or firewall and have never had any problems

From: The Claw
I've been using Windows for 7 or so years, without an antivirus or firewall and have never had any problems

Same.

RM - I did use ubuntu for many months last year but there were just too many problems with it so I just decided to go back to windows. Haven't had any problems since. I do however prefer linux to be used for servers

From: The Claw
I've been using Windows for 7 or so years, without an antivirus or firewall and have never had any problems

I've been using windows all my life with firewalls and antiviruses all my life and have aways had problems >.>

~RM

I do remember you having a virus Claw… And cycro too… But that was probably a few months ago.

From: Wizzup?
I'd say Windows 7 probably uses less RAM than Vista, but I don't really think the CPU usage will differ a lot. You'll still need a Firewall, Virus Scanner, and lots of other bloat.

CPU Usage for me is almost always 0-2%. 3% when browsing VillaVu with Firefox and about 5% when playing Freelancer. I have 1gig RAM.

Also, I only have MalwareBytes Anti-Malware free, but that doesn't AutoRun or have RTS. If I feel the need for a file to be scanned (which rarely happens), I'll just right click and scan from the context menu. Otherwise, Windows Firewall will alert me from any foreign/unallowed inbound and outbound connections (which also rarely happens) :p Never had a virus for about a year doing it this way.

Also, don't use Ubuntu if you're on a laptop and need wireless capabilities from a Broadcom adapter. It took almost forever to find a solution to get wireless to work. Also, openSUSE would be a better option for laptops anyway ;)

Also, a word of advice (speaking from experience here). DON'T have two desktop environments at once (e.g: GNOME and KDE) ;)

From: The Claw
I've been using Windows for 7 or so years, without an antivirus or firewall and have never had any problems

I do this, I use a partitioned hard drive plus another hard drive for files. 40gb partition for the win 7 OS.

I run Ubuntu on my laptop with wine and such due to the 3D acceleration being burned out now.

I prefer Win 7 over it, but this is due to the programs I run. To many are windows only and don't run on wine or run very well on wine to be worth it.

I haven't had any virus's on it yet (knock on wood) but I monitor my computer very critically, since I'm on it 8+ hours a day.

Its all on preference, convenience etc. up to the user.

[QUOTE=Dan's The Man;705461]CPU Usage for me is almost always 0-2%. 3% when browsing VillaVu with Firefox and about 5% when playing Freelancer. I have 1gig RAM.

Also, I only have MalwareBytes Anti-Malware free, but that doesn't AutoRun or have RTS. If I feel the need for a file to be scanned (which rarely happens), I'll just right click and scan from the context menu. Otherwise, Windows Firewall will alert me from any foreign/unallowed inbound and outbound connections (which also rarely happens) :p Never had a virus for about a year doing it this way.

Also, don't use Ubuntu if you're on a laptop and need wireless capabilities from a Broadcom adapter. It took almost forever to find a solution to get wireless to work. Also, openSUSE would be a better option for laptops anyway ;)

Also, a word of advice (speaking from experience here). DON'T have two desktop environments at once (e.g: GNOME and KDE) ;)

A virus scanner is quite harmless when you're not doing anything that does a lot of I/O. But since Virus Scanners have on-access scanning, they will slow down any program considerably. The more programs you run, the more cpu the virus scanner will use. ;)

I've never had a problem with wireless on Ubuntu. I see students on my uni struggle daily to make it work on Windows, but it always works on Ubuntu.

Also, how do you know you don't have a virus? I'm quite serious - a lot of people think viruses are very verbose and crash their system and stuff. But most viruses don't do this. On the contrary, they will hide as far as they can, so they won't be spotted but can still do their stuff.

how do you know that you do not have a virus Wizzup?

From: Dan Cardin
how do you know that you do not have a virus Wizzup?

Can a virus get a virus? :sasmokin:

From: Dan Cardin
how do you know that you do not have a virus Wizzup?

Because I've done my system checks. All my system binaries are correct, they have not been changed since the last time I built them. Therefore it is not possible that I have a virus. Especially considering there's not an other way (probably is, but not likely) to root a machine. I also have full control over what is started up, so there's no way a virus can start up like that either. Furthermore, my system does apply privileges properly, so there's no way something can have been injected because it can't even modify the system binaries. Most other services run their own user too.

ok then :)

From: Wizzup?
A virus scanner is quite harmless when you're not doing anything that does a lot of I/O. But since Virus Scanners have on-access scanning, they will slow down any program considerably. The more programs you run, the more cpu the virus scanner will use. ;)

I've never had a problem with wireless on Ubuntu. I see students on my uni struggle daily to make it work on Windows, but it always works on Ubuntu.

Also, how do you know you don't have a virus? I'm quite serious - a lot of people think viruses are very verbose and crash their system and stuff. But most viruses don't do this. On the contrary, they will hide as far as they can, so they won't be spotted but can still do their stuff.

Funny. It's the other way around for pretty much… anyone.. who has a Broadcom adapter (that I know of).

As for knowing whether malware is existent or not, I scan my computer about once every two months or so either when I'm not on it or when I am on it. Plus, if I suspect a file that I have downloaded is dangerous/unknown, I just usually scan it which usually takes less than a second. Scan results always come out with nil infections.

From: Wizzup?
I've never had a problem with wireless on Ubuntu. I see students on my uni struggle daily to make it work on Windows, but it always works on Ubuntu.

Actually that is quite false from what I experienced. When I first installed Ubuntu I managed to get myself connected to my wireless and every 20 or so seconds it would just reconnect for no reason, causing me to do whatever I was doing online to stop.

It was really really annoying and don't say I was too far out of range, because when I was using Vista (That's right, vista - 7 wasn't out yet) it connected perfectly fine and I never ever had this problem ever. It never just randomly reconnected for no reason. The other problem I had with the wireless was when I went to connect to my wifi, it would take ages and ages to connect then eventually say I was offline … That's when I decided to ditch linux and go back to windows where I didn't have to deal with this bullshit

I also remember reinstalling it too and after about a week of using it I turned it on one day and for some reason the clock didn't load … everything else loaded fine but the clock for some reason didn't and I didn't know how to fix it because there wasn't any help on that topic … and one problem I faced was when I installed the ubuntu netbook remix package it conflicted with GNOME causing the screen to flicker and display random things, so me trying to fix the problem, i uninstalled the netbook remix package and for some reason it was still there. You'd think it would be able to uninstall right?

But all is good now that I am back onto windows.

Conclusion seems to be try it out and see for yourself. Guess I'll just run it from a flash drive to entertain myself and then see what I prefer.

~RM

From: cycrosism
I also remember reinstalling it too and after about a week of using it I turned it on one day and for some reason the clock didn't load … everything else loaded fine but the clock for some reason didn't and I didn't know how to fix it because there wasn't any help on that topic … and one problem I faced was when I installed the ubuntu netbook remix package it conflicted with GNOME causing the screen to flicker and display random things, so me trying to fix the problem, i uninstalled the netbook remix package and for some reason it was still there. You'd think it would be able to uninstall right

Yeah, it is possible to uninstall it. It's more likely you just don't know how to uninstall it, and therefore claim it couldn't be uninstalled.

From: Rasta Magician
Conclusion seems to be try it out and see for yourself. Guess I'll just run it from a flash drive to entertain myself and then see what I prefer.

~RM

For just the feel you can also boot to a LiveCD, but it will be much slower. If you're planning on switching, I can also help you set some stuff up.

From: Wizzup?
Because I've done my system checks. All my system binaries are correct, they have not been changed since the last time I built them. Therefore it is not possible that I have a virus. Especially considering there's not an other way (probably is, but not likely) to root a machine. I also have full control over what is started up, so there's no way a virus can start up like that either. Furthermore, my system does apply privileges properly, so there's no way something can have been injected because it can't even modify the system binaries. Most other services run their own user too.

just to point out, not everyone is as linux savvy as you. If you encourage people to switch to linux, people like Rasta Magician, they will very likely treat their time on linux as very similar to their time on Windows. Meaning they're not necessarily linux savvy, so they wont know not to run code like the code that Harry was suggesting someone run a while back (which started a whole debacle).

You know whats up and so it makes it very difficult to be infected by viruses, average users (or average windows/other OS users switching to Linux at least) will not know quite so much as you, and will therefore be as vulnerable as Linux is (and quite possibly more so because of the aforementioned code, which i don't think would be considered a virus). Not to say that they will be more vulnerable than they were on windows, but they would be vulnerable still.

From: Dan Cardin
just to point out, not everyone is as linux savvy as you. If you encourage people to switch to linux, people like Rasta Magician, they will very likely treat their time on linux as very similar to their time on Windows. Meaning they're not necessarily linux savvy, so they wont know not to run code like the code that Harry was suggesting someone run a while back (which started a whole debacle).

You know whats up and so it makes it very difficult to be infected by viruses, average users (or average windows/other OS users switching to Linux at least) will not know quite so much as you, and will therefore be as vulnerable as Linux is (and quite possibly more so because of the aforementioned code, which i don't think would be considered a virus). Not to say that they will be more vulnerable than they were on windows, but they would be vulnerable still.

Haha, alright. Can you name me a few known Linux viruses? I only know of a few and those were actually windows viruses running in WINE. Like I tried to state in the post that you quoted, is that it is Linux's design what makes it so much more secure.

If you are referring to the rm -rf / code, then realize that deltree C:\ does the same in Windows. Of course, Linux does not protect you from running random code written by someone. (Something you should never just do) This doesn't go just for Windows, obviously. I'm just stating that viruses that come from IE, WMP, iTunes, torrents or similar won't bug you on Linux.

But yeah, you are always vulnerable if you don't use your brain. But Linux does a better job at protecting you than Windows.

From: Wizzup?
Yeah, it is possible to uninstall it. It's more likely you just don't know how to uninstall it, and therefore claim it couldn't be uninstalled.

Hmm so you're saying that writing sudo apt-get uninstall blah blah(on ubuntu) doesn't actually uninstall the whole program? Well at least I don't face that problem on windows, here it actually removes the whole program.

[extremely-offtopic]If you like macs so much, look up osx86 and hackintosh, it's not that hard to do :)[/extremely-offtopic]

From: cycrosism
Hmm so you're saying that writing sudo apt-get uninstall blah blah(on ubuntu) doesn't actually uninstall the whole program? Well at least I don't face that problem on windows, here it actually removes the whole program.

If you are referring to Add/Remove Programs, then not always. Sometimes a lot gets left behind and you have to use a program like Revo Uninstaller. Norton and McAfee are so bad they provide specific removal tools.

From: cycrosism
Hmm so you're saying that writing sudo apt-get uninstall blah blah(on ubuntu) doesn't actually uninstall the whole program? Well at least I don't face that problem on windows, here it actually removes the whole program.

In fact, Windows doesn't do stuff properly when it comes to uninstalling. The application itself has to offer a Uninstaller, and otherwise you can't uninstall it on Windows.

And yeah, you got the wrong command wrong all right. Try using something that's made for noobs, Synaptics Package Manager for example, it will suit you better.

From: Markus
[extremely-offtopic]If you like macs so much, look up osx86 and hackintosh, it's not that hard to do :)[/extremely-offtopic]

I actually looked into this awhile ago because I wanted to run some Mac programs but don't have a mac… Does it work well? I had problems with the one I ran, getting the correct drivers etc.

From: Narcle
I actually looked into this awhile ago because I wanted to run some Mac programs but don't have a mac… Does it work well? I had problems with the one I ran, getting the correct drivers etc.

It depends on the computer, mine doesn't support the mouse keyboard sound or wireless :p

Just get the right drivers and it'll run fine, or at least it does for me. There are tons of resources available at http://www.insanelymac.com in case you can't get it to work completely.

From: Narcle
I actually looked into this awhile ago because I wanted to run some Mac programs but don't have a mac… Does it work well? I had problems with the one I ran, getting the correct drivers etc.

I have tried it in VirtualBox, but it doesn't run too well. QEMU does a better job at running it, but Networking is still an issue. (I wanted it for Simba development…)
I don't see much other reasons to use it, especially not as a main OS. ;)

From: Wizzup?
I have tried it in VirtualBox, but it doesn't run too well. QEMU does a better job at running it, but Networking is still an issue. (I wanted it for Simba development…)
I don't see much other reasons to use it, especially not as a main OS. ;)

It was to run a bot. Mac OS locks out privileges to monitor ram etc. without permission from the admin(User). Making it ideal for bots to run without much detection.

Honestly, all of the problems I have seen people post with their Linux systems sound completely PEBCAK.

Also: Its just common sense not to run code others have provided you with unless you read over it.

well if you're like many windows users i see (i would think through lack of general computer knowledge, rather than being on windows) have no idea what anything does, and so they would not know not to run bits of code, or not know not to run random applications. What's common sense to you may not be common sense to others.

get a new computer with Windows 7.

From: scuz 10
get a new computer with Windows 7.

Or just install it ?

From: cycrosism
Or just install it ?

New comp + W7 > Old comp + W7

Out of curiosity, (and don't hate me everyone), have you tried Windows 7? For me, it's worked so well. Its not so much of a resource hog as Vista, the task bar is GREAT, and it's easily torrented :)

From: drags111
Out of curiosity, (and don't hate me everyone), have you tried Windows 7? For me, it's worked so well. Its not so much of a resource hog as Vista, the task bar is GREAT, and it's easily torrented :)

I have tried windows 7, and I use the 64bit version on my desktop. Why would everyone hate you for using windows? Most of the world uses it.

I do have to agree with you about the resources, vista used so much ram … and windows 7 is actually great for SSD's. But, I still use windows XP on my netbook because it is OEM, I am not sure if I would benefit from installing windows 7 on it because I only have 1gb of ram on here.

From: cycrosism
I have tried windows 7, and I use the 64bit version on my desktop. Why would everyone hate you for using windows? Most of the world uses it.

I do have to agree with you about the resources, vista used so much ram … and windows 7 is actually great for SSD's. But, I still use windows XP on my netbook because it is OEM, I am not sure if I would benefit from installing windows 7 on it because I only have 1gb of ram on here.

Well I just know there are some REALLY anti windows people on this thread haha. But yah, 7 isnt the best for a netbook, but for a normal desktop, I definitely think its a good choice.

I think my netbook should run 7 basic just fine but im not going to bother i am fine with xp on here

i think it would be kinda cool to see 7 on a netbook haha.

From: cycrosism
I have tried windows 7, and I use the 64bit version on my desktop. Why would everyone hate you for using windows? Most of the world uses it.

I do have to agree with you about the resources, vista used so much ram … and windows 7 is actually great for SSD's. But, I still use windows XP on my netbook because it is OEM, I am not sure if I would benefit from installing windows 7 on it because I only have 1gb of ram on here.

I use Win7 (not OEM) on my laptop (Acer Aspire 5720Z, 1GB RAM) and it never uses more than 350mb (unless I'm running a game which happens to be the memory hog, or using Firefox). I also installed Win7 on my Grandpa's desktop (512MB RAM) and it never uses more than 250MB and runs smoothly (no tweaks).

[QUOTE=Dan's The Man;708188]I use Win7 (not OEM) on my laptop (Acer Aspire 5720Z, 1GB RAM) and it never uses more than 350mb (unless I'm running a game which happens to be the memory hog, or using Firefox). I also installed Win7 on my Grandpa's desktop (512MB RAM) and it never uses more than 250MB and runs smoothly (no tweaks).

That sounds pretty good, is that the 32 bit you installed on your laptop?

From: cycrosism
That sounds pretty good, is that the 32 bit you installed on your laptop?

There's no 64-bit version of the 5720Z, so I assume so, yeah..

[[[Moderately a necropost. Sorry. :P]]]

[Off topic]
Windows 7 is really interesting with how it handles install and services. I run it on my desktop, (Dell Inspiron 530; 4GB of RAM, NVIDIA 9800 graphics card, quad core 2.66GHz processor, etc. I got it as a Christmas present. What can I say?) and it takes around 750MB to 1GB of RAM just to boot up. It also shows the infamous W7 boot up animation (the four colors clashing and exploding).

However, it's different for my netbook (1000HE; chipset graphics, Atom 1.66GHz, 2GB of RAM). It shows the 'old' Vista boot up screen (grey bar with a very pixellated loading bar), and runs at around 300-400MB of RAM consumed.

It will self-optimize for the system that it's on during installation, so that systems that are easily bogged down aren't overloaded with features, but those with i7's and 48GB of RAM will be very nice to use.
[/Off topic]

Basically, I agree with what's been said here. I've been using Ubuntu for about a year now, and am quite happy with it. Though I'll probably swap distro some time soon (SuSE looks like a good candidate, Hell, I may even try BSD if I'm feeling in a learning mood), it's been an overall excellent experience.

Install whichever version you want, and- at least while you're beginning- stick with Ubuntu Software Center > Synaptic Package Manager > Anything that requires you using a cli directly. Software Center is- by far- the most user friendly, with the Package Manager GUI coming in for those who have been with *nix for a few weeks/months.

Linux can be quite the change; some people like to dive in to it, while others want to slowly get their feet wet. The approach you take is your choice; either way, you'll learn quite a bit and escape Windows. :P

Best of luck!
- Macro

Compiled succesfully in 25 ms.
RM on Ubuntu!
Successfully executed.

I've been using ubuntu for a couple weeks. Haven't had much of a chance to use it, just to play around with it for a little bit every time. I found some lectures from university for using linux OS's which makes it very friendly to get used to the 'unusual' side of ubuntu.

I've also found it very user friendly in most cases, and the ability to fully customize it keeps me very entertained and makes me love it more and more everyday. It's bugged up a few times (eg Evolution (default email manager) ) but I suspect that might be me not knowing how it works and it not knowing how I want it to work :p

Very fast, especially compared to vista. That allows me to breath better every morning. Whenever I turn on my laptop and just leave it, coming back to find the Vista login screen I shut it down and re-boot it.

I'd advise the change to anyone who is sick of windows, as I was.

~RM

I'm glad to see you've made the switch.

What was your issue with Evolution? I use it for all of my email accounts, I've probably come across a similar issue.