SRL Archive - Discussions & Debates

So, every single person thinks differently. They like different things, they are scared of different things. Some people are smarter, some more willing. Some like staying indoors looking at screens, some enjoy going outside and get hurt. Emotions. So what is it that controls our feelings? Perhaps something "supernatural? A God perhaps? Do you think someone/thing is controlling what we think?

Discuss.

how we are raised, experience through life from when we first open our eyes…..

From: Brain
how we are raised, experience through life from when we first open our eyes…..

But that leads a chain, doesn't it? You are normally raised how your parents are raised, they are raised similarly to how their parents were raised. Until you get to the top of the chain. Someone had to think for themselves to start off with.

That also doesn't explain who you end up liking. People can end up falling in love with someone they really didn't expect to. Although it has been proven that humans subconsciously smell other people (you can't tell this), and you generally want to be around that person more. So I guess, you do really have a "soul-mate".

1. we were born with our bodies
2. we were born into our enviorment

unless there is a god that controles this, then i think we think, feel, do what we were made to think feel or do. The combination of each individual body reacting to its individual envoirment makes for alot of origional people, and i would say each person's thoughts/everything are controled by the world around us aswell as the way our brains were programed.

I dunno, LOL.Our answers are also dependent on the thing that makes us different. So it's a loop of us thinking about why we are how we are, and then thinking why we think how we think and why we think how we are, etc.).

From: Richard
Perhaps something "supernatural? A God perhaps? Do you think someone/thing is controlling what we think?

Discuss.

Well i kno my god isn't controlling our feeling (free will)

anyways on to the topic everyone thinks different because of the different gene pools no one think exacttly the same


and with deodorant u cant smell each other c asue the pheromones that we smell come out of the armpits which people think stick so really your smelling a deodorant




edit i bet im gonna get counterdicted in about 20 seconds

From: J_Pizzle
Well i kno my god isn't controlling our feeling (free will)

anyways on to the topic everyone thinks different because of the different gene pools no one think exacttly the same


and with deodorant u cant smell each other c asue the pheromones that we smell come out of the armpits which people think stick so really your smelling a deodorant




edit i bet im gonna get counterdicted in about 20 seconds

Contradicted*. Haha sorry, just had to! :) And what does deodorant have to do with anything? 'o.O

From: 99_ aka ian.
Contradicted*. Haha sorry, just had to! :) And what does deodorant have to do with anything? 'o.O

well he says that we smeel the person and the pheromones that we smell come out of our armpits and thats wat BO is and what does deodarent do stops BO

Pleasure and happiness seem to be controlling a lot of people. Anyways I believe God gave everyone free will which is a very special gift.

From: IceFire908
Pleasure and happiness seem to be controlling a lot of people.

is that a bad thing?

the bible both says that we do and dont have free will. I personaly think "free will" is an illusion and if we have any its extreamly limeted.

so me not believing in god is because god wants me to not believe in him? deep stuff there

There's not answer for some things. Just like "What is the meaning of life?", this is another thing that should be up to the individual. People will argue about anything and everything, but this is probably the top question that you can ask. Whatever makes you content with yourself, I guess.

From: Brain
so me not believing in god is because god wants me to not believe in him? deep stuff there

Romans 9:16-24 (New International Version)
16It does not, therefore, depend on man's desire or effort, but on God's mercy. 17For the Scripture says to Pharaoh: "I raised you up for this very purpose, that I might display my power in you and that my name might be proclaimed in all the earth."[a] 18Therefore God has mercy on whom he wants to have mercy, and he hardens whom he wants to harden.

19One of you will say to me: "Then why does God still blame us? For who resists his will?" 20But who are you, O man, to talk back to God? "Shall what is formed say to him who formed it, 'Why did you make me like this?' " 21Does not the potter have the right to make out of the same lump of clay some pottery for noble purposes and some for common use?

22What if God, choosing to show his wrath and make his power known, bore with great patience the objects of his wrath—prepared for destruction? 23What if he did this to make the riches of his glory known to the objects of his mercy, whom he prepared in advance for glory— 24even us, whom he also called, not only from the Jews but also from the Gentiles?

yup, according to christianity, brian you would be chosen to be damned. Sorry bout that D=
better luck next time.

Oh look, the ol' nature vs. nurture debate.

Good luck…

EDIT: Please stop quoting the old testament, it is so very dated…

Parents, friends, role-models, timing, and the environment are all factors in how a person thinks.

Examples:
Parents: One who has two parents helping and supporting them (emotionally and financially) through school/college is far more likely to get a successful job than one in an orphanage.

Friends: If one's friends do drugs/alcohol, one is more likely than if one's friends don't. Law of "it's cool, my friends do it, and I don't want to feel left out".

Role-models: goto Friends;

Timing: The example with the most impact would be this- one would have emotional trauma if one had sex at the age of 5. However, if one had sex at the age of 20, it's far less likely for there to be trauma. :P

I actually just read an interesting book on the mind, encompassing human thought, called Dianetics.

Basically I believe that every single human has an Analytical mind and a Reactive mind. The analytical mind is basically your mind that computes rational thought and makes the best decisions pertaining to your survival. Your reactive mind is your mind that records moments of pain and unconsciousness.

Your analytical mind thinks in rational concepts, differentiating things from each other.

Your reactive mind think is irrational A=A=A concepts, and is quite stupid if you ask me.

For example let's take a situation and look at it though the analytical mind and the reactive mind:

A man walks up to you on a street late at night, hits you over the head, pushes you to the ground, takes your wallet, and then kicks you. While he is doing this a sprinkler is going off, a dog is barking, and a car is passing by.

Your analytical mind would recall the situation with something like: If I walk down that street again at night, I might get mugged again, and therefore I should avoid doing that again.

Your reactive mind would recall it something like this: man walking late at night=hit=pain=loss=sound of sprinkler=sound of dog= sound of car.
Crazy right? EXACTLY! The reactive mind, unlike it's counterpart, the analytical mind, is outrageously idiotic. All of the information recorded in your reactive mind in a particular situation is called an Engram

All of your engrams ever recorded are stored in the Reactive mind bank, which is basically the place where all of your painful or unconscious recordings are stored.

Now let's say you're walking down the same street you got mugged at. You see a man talking down the street, you hear a dog bark, and perhaps you hear a car drive by. These are called restimulators, which restimulate your engram, thus impinging it upon your analytical mind, making you act irrationally. You might run down the street in fear of being mugged when there is no danger present; you might feel a pain in your body where you were hit when you got mugged. All in all, you would act irrationally when an engram is restimulated.

And that's pretty much the cause of irrational behavior =/ (the reactive mind)


Whew, I didn't really mean to make a post that long, but I think it definitely should be seriously considered when one is regarding the mind. Please note that my explanations aren't 100%, if you want to learn more, read Dianetics by L. Ron Hubbard.


And if you couldn't follow my ramblings, here's a quick recap of my entire post:
Analytical mind: <3
Reactive mind: </3

Your reactive mind think is irrational A=A=A concepts

i dont see whats irrational about that… A = A = A is a very logical statement and seems quite rational to me haha.

but i think i understand you, though i would argue that everything our mink thinks is a reaction to our surroundings.. its just when addreniline and stress are also involved the mind gives controle over to your instinkts and dosnt pay as much attention to absorbing facts from your surroundings, makeing you idiotic.. but realy its a good trade off isnt it? momentaral survival for momentaral rationality lol.

Two different people have completely different brains. Because of how a human forms, there is no way for them to think exactly alike, because the synaptic connections of one could not possible exist in another as the cells are in a different location.

From: lancerawks aka Lance
i dont see whats irrational about that… A = A = A is a very logical statement and seems quite rational to me haha.

Anything=Anything=Anything is actually quite irrational, I'll give you another example so maybe you can understand it better:

A child takes a cookie from a jar and accidentally knocks it over, breaking the jar. The child's mother then pushes the child out of the way in anger and the child hit's his head on a wall and is knocked unconscious. The mother, upset, then says something like "you're a theif".

The reactive mind uses A=A=A logic and interprets this situation as: cookies=jar knocking over=angry mother=pain=upset="you're a theif".

cookies=pain? That's pretty irrational to me.

Analytically, the child would differentiate cookies and pain, and recognize that cookies are fine and good, just be careful not to knock jars over in the future because it might upset mother.

From: R0b0t1
Two different people have completely different brains. Because of how a human forms, there is no way for them to think exactly alike, because the synaptic connections of one could not possible exist in another as the cells are in a different location.

That is, of course, if you're interested in the structure of the mind rather than the function. It's true that no two humans are exactly alike, however I, as well as Dianetics, am not concerned so much with structure, just the function of the mind.

The structure affects not the function, but the method of action. This thread is not about the function of the mind, it is about the method of action.

From: R0b0t1
The structure affects not the function, but the method of action. This thread is not about the function of the mind, it is about the method of action.

Says whom? The thread starter? No.

I don't know about you, but I think the function of the mind is just as important as the structure if not more important.

If you have a theory that works almost 100% of the time, you should first be concerned about the theory, and after that, the structure of it.

It was mainly discussing the way in which the mind decides to think what it does. Why do some authors just get the ideas for books? The idea surely can't just "appear".

Another thing to think about, Human Rights: The freedom of thought.

I'm not an author, but I'm writing a story right now, and I get the ideas from real life stuff, depression, friends, family, news, anything that I find interesting. 'Interesting' to me (story material) is anything sad/depressing, but is also real life stuff that people think about and deal with (from what I've experienced from friends/family/myself).

Hopefully that means something to you, or helps with your question.

From: 99_ aka ian.
I'm not an author, but I'm writing a story right now, and I get the ideas from real life stuff, depression, friends, family, news, anything that I find interesting. 'Interesting' to me (story material) is anything sad/depressing, but is also real life stuff that people think about and deal with (from what I've experienced from friends/family/myself).

Hopefully that means something to you, or helps with your question.

But what about people that come up with ideas that have never even been considered? Think about the first person to paint a picture of something that didn't exist. Where did that inspiration come from?

Probably the same reason I write. They find something they they think other people should know about, and express it how they're able to. If I could draw, I would draw about stuff that mattered to me, and I wanted to share with people.

But you're still missing my point, there have been paintings that are completely unrelated to anything, like this:

Has no relation to anything, what gave the artist the idea?

From: MetalancA
Says whom? The thread starter? No.

I don't know about you, but I think the function of the mind is just as important as the structure if not more important.

If you have a theory that works almost 100% of the time, you should first be concerned about the theory, and after that, the structure of it.

Did you even understand what I meant?

From: R0b0t1
Did you even understand what I meant?

To be honest, not really. You were being kind of vague and you didn't really try to explain your point of view clearly to me =/ I just tried to give you an answer that fit your response lol.

From: Richard
But you're still missing my point, there have been paintings that are completely unrelated to anything, like this:

Has no relation to anything, what gave the artist the idea?

Maybe they're a bad artist? Maybe they did it for the lulz? Maybe they just thought of something, obscured it, and drew it like that? Ask them. :)

oooooh i love this argument ! no one ever wins! but hesres my thought:

before i go any further….let me just make this clear. im not christian or athiest. some consider me agnostic but i kinda have my "own" religion which is based on stuff i belive in. its not really a religion. just my personal beliefs.

the following arguments are FOR AND AGAINST bible etc.
oh sorry if i got carried away. i love this topic and am always interested in what people think. and especially what people think of what i think. it helps me understand my own flaws. which im well aware there are many.
===============================================

["proof" certain religions are false]

1)

if gods all powerfull [as it so happens to state] , dont u think that everything would be pointless? he wouldnt have to "fight" the devil he could just snap his fingers. he would also have no need to "test" us as his all power should be able to forsee the end? and make everything pointless.

2)

lets jump back a few thousand years ago into greece. many generations zues is god. hmm couple thousand years later..
1:"uhh im getin tired of zues… wana call it somtin else?
2:"yeah ok…but i get to pick"

well kinda proven in history. everything that has a beggining has an end. where one religion fails, another takes its place. and yes all things will fail eventually and that marks a new begingin for something else.

3)

(this doesnt prove much but im just saying)
go look in the bible and find somthing. a fact. anything. got to a few random christian\bible people and ask about it. (or u can make up ur own thing to try and contradict the bible and ask about it.)
listen to their answers. notice how all of them are different and yet they all bend towards the correctness of that person….

hmmm…..

4)

even if the bible "Was" a book ….it was written in script (not srl ahah)…so what your reading could very well be bent translations by random people. how would you know the difference?

======================================================

enough anti bible….lets look at the "spiritual" side of things.

well for one thing, religion has been around ever since man has. it is simply a belief system. no matter what you belive in, its just thoughts….i personally belive in the power of mind (that perhaps if you believe hard enough you can achieve it)[no i dont mean think about being rich and be rich…]

ok so:

1)

i am a human being. or am i? in fact i am gazillions of tiny organisms. ones that are me and arent me. yet strange, i function as one… in fact, i function independantly as one so much, that i can actualy by sheer will just chop off my finger. now how can gazillions of cells possibly think as one? hmmm….
dont you think theres a little more to death than disappear?

2)

lets go down even further. if you think about it….arent wel all just elements from them table? in fact we are all matter? and i look at this computer and see it too is matter, yet it does not function as i do. that matter has no mind of its own. it cannot think as one. it has no emotion… but hey lets call this spirit/soul just as reference….

======================================================

well those are the basics of my own belif system not including morals and other finer detailed explanations (which in some cases DO contradict themselves) so my beliefs do have faults by in my oppinion have more truths than other beliefs. or so it would seem.

thoughts?!?!?!?!^^^^^^^^^^^

edit:lol is this even about what i thought it was? it no longer seems so.

The structure of the brain (on a cellular level) affects how it works. It may achieve the same ends, but through different means.

From: Ouivile
oooooh i love this argument ! no one ever wins! but hesres my thought:

before i go any further….let me just make this clear. im not christian or athiest. some consider me agnostic but i kinda have my "own" religion which is based on stuff i belive in. its not really a religion. just my personal beliefs.

the following arguments are FOR AND AGAINST bible etc.
oh sorry if i got carried away. i love this topic and am always interested in what people think. and especially what people think of what i think. it helps me understand my own flaws. which im well aware there are many.
===============================================

["proof" certain religions are false]

1)

if gods all powerfull [as it so happens to state] , dont u think that everything would be pointless? he wouldnt have to "fight" the devil he could just snap his fingers. he would also have no need to "test" us as his all power should be able to forsee the end? and make everything pointless.

2)

lets jump back a few thousand years ago into greece. many generations zues is god. hmm couple thousand years later..
1:"uhh im getin tired of zues… wana call it somtin else?
2:"yeah ok…but i get to pick"

well kinda proven in history. everything that has a beggining has an end. where one religion fails, another takes its place. and yes all things will fail eventually and that marks a new begingin for something else.

3)

(this doesnt prove much but im just saying)
go look in the bible and find somthing. a fact. anything. got to a few random christian\bible people and ask about it. (or u can make up ur own thing to try and contradict the bible and ask about it.)
listen to their answers. notice how all of them are different and yet they all bend towards the correctness of that person….

hmmm…..

4)

even if the bible "Was" a book ….it was written in script (not srl ahah)…so what your reading could very well be bent translations by random people. how would you know the difference?

======================================================

enough anti bible….lets look at the "spiritual" side of things.

well for one thing, religion has been around ever since man has. it is simply a belief system. no matter what you belive in, its just thoughts….i personally belive in the power of mind (that perhaps if you believe hard enough you can achieve it)[no i dont mean think about being rich and be rich…]

ok so:

1)

i am a human being. or am i? in fact i am gazillions of tiny organisms. ones that are me and arent me. yet strange, i function as one… in fact, i function independantly as one so much, that i can actualy by sheer will just chop off my finger. now how can gazillions of cells possibly think as one? hmmm….
dont you think theres a little more to death than disappear?

2)

lets go down even further. if you think about it….arent wel all just elements from them table? in fact we are all matter? and i look at this computer and see it too is matter, yet it does not function as i do. that matter has no mind of its own. it cannot think as one. it has no emotion… but hey lets call this spirit/soul just as reference….

======================================================

well those are the basics of my own belif system not including morals and other finer detailed explanations (which in some cases DO contradict themselves) so my beliefs do have faults by in my oppinion have more truths than other beliefs. or so it would seem.

thoughts?!?!?!?!^^^^^^^^^^^

edit:lol is this even about what i thought it was? it no longer seems so.

Bible bashing:
2) the abriamic religion that became Judaism and then Christianity is MUCH older than Zeus lol. It wasn’t just “oh I need a new religion, how about following that Jesus guy..”

anti-spiritualist part
you made a statement about religion but didn’t give any proof for it. Why do you think its just all in our head? And I don’t really understand “that perhaps if you believe hard enough you can achieve it”, why wouldn’t you be able to achieve it? Besides believing alone isn’t enough to achieve something, you would need to put your thoughts into practice and work hard to get good results.

1) I don’t see what that has to do with an afterlife :P

2) we feel emotions because of chemicals in our head, and we think because our brains are both so much more extremely complex than a computer, and are built entirely different from a computer. And I don’t see what our bodies being made of chemicals has to do with spirituality. Pluss, I don’t think there is any proof what so ever that we have souls. I am a Christian but I do not believe in a “soul.”


And to the picture: i dont think it was because he was a bad artist (though he probably is), just that you cant feel the same feelings he felt while painting it. He oviously had some reason, even being random and spontanious is a reason and would reflect in his art to him, but not to anyone else. I guess that is how you can tell good art from bad art.. if others can understand the feelings your trying to show.

and debateing this kinda stuff is all good for fun, but i doubt any of us actualy know how the human mind works xD im pretty sure even scientists dont realy know

God did it because the bible says so, and the bible is true because it says so on the bible. I know this because my parents have always told me that, I'm uncomfortable about my insignificance in the universe, I'm uneducated about all blasphemous nonsense like evolution and like all other people I'm afraid of death so it's nice to have paradise waiting for me while all the non-believers and fools that believe in a different ancient middle-eastern book will go to suffer eternally by an evil force my loving god made to punish people who disagree with me. I will now proceed to cover my eyes and ears and crawl under my bed, thank you all.

From: Richard
But you're still missing my point, there have been paintings that are completely unrelated to anything, like this:

Has no relation to anything, what gave the artist the idea?

Lol, maybe the artist was using my scar-script : http://www.villavu.com/forum/showthread.php?t=48285