SRL Archive - Discussions & Debates

It has come to my attention that millions of mathmaticans are lying to you!

they say pi is an irrational number!

So you believe pi is a never-ending number, approximately 3.14?
I did too at one point in my life, and i went to a good Christian school.

However i have since read the bible and seen the error of my ways, God is just, he forgave me and saved me. He can save you too.

Please do not come to this thread with a closed mind!

They didn't give me a developers cup for nothing! In fact i know that Wizzup and Benland also believe pi is exactly 3, and there are many more!


The bible says that the mathematical constant pi is exactly 3

From: I Kings 7:23-26
He made the Sea of cast metal, circular in shape, measuring ten cubits from rim to rim and five cubits high. It took a line of thirty cubits to measure around it.

so there was a circle, with diameter 10 units and circumference 30 units.
=> 30 = pi * 10
=> pi = 3

God say it! it must be true!
There is absolutely no mention of the idea that pi is irrational.

who are these evil, homosexual, terrorist mathematicians, thinking they can improve on God's work?
PI == IRRATIONAL, IS JUST A THEORY



These mathematicians keep changing their minds! they are clearly running around like a chicken with its head cut off.

First, they said pi was equal to 22/7
then they changed their minds, so it was 3.15
the theory keeps on changing, when will it end?

its clearly a theory in crisis.



you might hear of a 'mathematician' called Leibniz who came up with a mathematical series to calculate pi, it seems all well and good, until you give it a moments thought.
Leibniz was found to be a fake, he doctored his forumlas, mislead the public.

So my point is, there are evil mathematicians who will lie to you!
think about it, whats to stop them? they can say whatever they want.
they just want to be rich and famous, they have no morals to guide them.



someone give me one fact, just one fact about pi == irrational.


you might point to a so-called 'proof' by someone called Niven,
but Niven recanted on his deathbed!, he was dying, he was afraid to go to hell, and admitted that his proof was all wrong, and pi was actually 3.



I propose we Teach the Controversy, children need to learn the art of debate, they need to hear both sides of the story.

In fact, the most famous mathematician Glen Greaves(no less) from Harvard (no less) agreed.


You guys should all read your bibles to see the truth!

And don't quote from wikipedia because that is an extremely BIAS website written by COMMUNISTS!

AH MEN BROTHER!
Glad you finally saw the light (super sarcasm)

Wow you obviously took that too literally it said "Circular in shape" not "it was a perfect circle"…

We know pi is 3 :D.

Just one of those well know mistakes ;).

Why would God let a book be written in his name that is open for interpretation? If we wrote our laws like that…I could say I thought that's what it meant. This only brings trouble…

From: sirlaughsalot
Wow you obviously took that too literally it said "Circular in shape" not "it was a perfect circle"…

how can you decide which parts to take or not take literally?

iv taken it to mean a perfect circle, you might have your own interpretation (which is wrong btw, but it doesn't matter since you're going to hell because of it)


also, one of those evolutionists could say exactly the same thing about the fact of creation. (but they are wrong too, since god said so, and they are going to hell as well)

From: Yakman
how can you decide which parts to take or not take literally?

iv taken it to mean a perfect circle, you might have your own interpretation (which is wrong btw, but it doesn't matter since you're going to hell because of it)

You decide by the language it uses, such as… "Circular" the definition of that word is

1. Of or relating to a circle.

You can take it literally what i meant was, you somehow made it something it is not…

absolutely not! the bible says it plain and simple, i just thought you all could do with some reminding.
the bible gives the measurement for a circumference and a diameter, its only logical to work out the ratio. so we can use it to make other circles.

you see, God wanted to help us, because he loves us. So he made pi a simple and easy-to-use number.
its just these evil people want to remove God from the world, and they must be stopped!


I have no doubt that when God was telling people to write the people, he said to himself "Oh yes they'll find this very useful when they want to invent the wheel!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pi

3.14159 26535 89793 23846 26433 83279 50288 41971 69399 37510

Never wrong.

nice find! i would've never known :(.

From: Sp0rky
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pi

3.14159 26535 89793 23846 26433 83279 50288 41971 69399 37510

Never wrong.

Not on everything, but one this one yes.

Of course, pi is the relationship between a radius to perimeter. Solution? Get the closest to round shape you can get and measure diameter and perimeter and divide to get a number above 3. Of course, this method isn't 100% accurate, but if you measured a lot of circles, you would find it would more often than not be above 3 rather than equally below and above as you would expect when there's a little variance in size due to not perfectly round.

Dang it, all my calculus has gone to waste… Im just glad that god is forgiving and allows my computer to run even though those heathens used the incorrect form of PI in their calculations.

Im also glad he saved those guys that landed on the moon. If he allowed them to use their origional calculations with the incorrect form of PI, they would have missed the moon all together! But he saved them and let them get to the moon, even though they where mistaken in their beliefs.

;) :P

From: Sp0rky
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pi

3.14159 26535 89793 23846 26433 83279 50288 41971 69399 37510

Never wrong.

I've already covered wikipedia, don't quote from it because that is an extremely BIAS website!

God said pi is 3, so if wikipedia says otherwise, then wikipedia must be wrong!



mixster, God is testing your faith with that, like he did with fossils and DNA, remember?

God says Pi = 3?

How do we know God exists? We dont know if anything exists. Look out your window, you see whatever, but do you actually? Or are we in a Matrix Type world? Are we being controlled by another force? If we wake up, is that 'real' world real? Or are we in a continum or constant Matrixes?

We have no idea do we.

Can you prove that Pi = 3? Can you prove it doesnt. Pie could equal 2.5 and you would get some credit somewhere just for saying it does.

EDIT:

mixster, God is testing your faith with that, like he did with fossils and DNA, remember?

Is that a Bill Hicks reference? Or are you being serious?

And if you are: DINOSAURS. Is that God testing your faith?

We know god exists because he is forcing this coin to land the same way up 10 times in a row. 1 in 2^10 can't just be random.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X1uJD1O3L08


If you don't get it, go to 7 minutes here youtube.com/watch?v=IhinuvloAmc

first - wow Boreas posted where i could see it!
second - who says its 1? (to Boreas)
third -

Matrixes?

Matrices?

From: Yakman
children need to learn the art of debate

Isn't "Because God said so" a very poor basis for your side of an argument? There is no proof to the existence of a God, nor any proof to the contrary. Since it's not a fact, and is totally unproven for either side, in a debate God is just as useful as the leprechauns that live in my sock drawer.

In a debate you should use facts to back up your opinion. If you don't have any evidence other than God said so, then there isn't even a basis for a debate here.


( I assume that this is a joke thread? )

Thank you! I shall repent my sins and make sure that I spread the word of this – the word of truth!

Matrices?

Matrix = The film idea. So a continum of Matrixes would be just the same thing, is any world a 'real' world.

From: richk1693
Isn't "Because God said so" a very poor basis for your side of an argument? There is no proof to the existence of a God, nor any proof to the contrary. Since it's not a fact, and is totally unproven for either side, in a debate God is just as useful as the leprechauns that live in my sock drawer.

In a debate you should use facts to back up your opinion. If you don't have any evidence other than God said so, then there isn't even a basis for a debate here.

yeah but the great thing about God is that he operates outside the normal rules of logic and reason.
so asking for proof for the existence of God simply makes no sense.

(yes this thread is completely tongue-in-cheek)

So scar lies too :p?

program New;

begin
  Writeln(FloatToStr(Pi));
end.

3,14159265358979
Successfully executed

Can we also take in the fact that the cubit wasn't always the same length, they many times used the length of their forearm to measure a cubit. Also, I read an article about this before and as it stated, the only non-whole cubit ever mentioned was a half-cubit, so we can assume that they would round up or down if it was 3/4 or 1/4.

Also, I have lost respect for you. I take this as you are purposely making threads to create enmity whether that is what you meant or not.

@ boreas :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RAiBdiqVjvw&feature=related

start at 2 mins :p

From: Bobarkinator
Can we also take in the fact that the cubit wasn't always the same length, they many times used the length of their forearm to measure a cubit.

that doesn't matter because pi is a ratio.
i can measure circumference and diameter in centimeters, feet, bananas, light years.
so a cubit can be whatever you want it to be, pi will always be the same

From: Bobarkinator
Also, I read an article about this before and as it stated, the only non-whole cubit ever mentioned was a half-cubit, so we can assume that they would round up or down if it was 3/4 or 1/4.

im sorry but i find it hard to believe that God would leave us out of the loop like this.
he loves us, surely he wouldn't want us to make mistakes when we're building bridges or whatever.
the bible says nothing about it being irrational, nothing about it being never ending.

From: Bobarkinator
Also, I have lost respect for you. I take this as you are purposely making threads to create enmity whether that is what you meant or not.

<yakman gets out of character>
i didn't know i even had your respect at all, I'm quite flattered.

I made this thread to show exactly what people are doing when they blind themselves to proper evidence.
of course no-one actually believes pi is 3, a nine year old with some rope could work that out.

but it says to people "if you believe the biblical story of creation, you have to believe that pi = 3"
I think a lot of people are doing what George Orwell called doublethink, where you hold two contradicting beliefs in your head, but there is no conflict.


also i wanted to see what it was like when you're arguing for the other side.

and its quite ironic that a lot of people have told me to go read my bible, but when i told [name-withheld] about pi=3, he had no idea what i was talking about
<yakman gets back into character>

EDIT:

From: pwnaz0r
WOW YAKMAN. Very impressive. Why can't you think the same things about God? I say the exact same things as you, about scientists lying to you, and things and such, and you believe this but not me. I have very good facts, I'm impressed. Seriously though, this is the first time I have seen you with an open mind :)

I'm not serious you know… read the above before this edit

EDIT2: oh dear, you deleted your post :o

edit:…

From: Dark_Sniper
@ boreas :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RAiBdiqVjvw&feature=related

start at 2 mins :p

Highlight or quote my post?

Deleted this part.

The aforementioned scripture states that the molten sea was &#8220;ten cubits from brim to brim&#8221; and &#8220;a line of thirty cubits did compass it round about;&#8221; thus, its diameter was 10 cubits, and its circumference 30 cubits. Dividing this circumference of 30 by a diameter of 10 gives a value of exactly 3. This is where the questions arise. It is commonly known that the value of &#960; is approximately 3.14159265358979. In fact, this value has been proven so exactly, that its value is known to hundreds of thousands of digits.

Why then does the Bible appear to give the value of &#960; to be 3? A diameter of 10 cubits should yield a circle having a circumference of more that 31.4 cubits–not 30 cubits. Is the Bible just rounding things off? Are the Biblical values just approximate and not really exact? If we see here that the scripture is not exact, what other passages also contain words that cannot be received with complete accuracy?

1 Kings 7:26 It [the above mentioned metal pool] was a handbreadth in thickness, and its rim was like the rim of a cup, like a lily blossom. It held two thousand baths.

If the diameter of this bowl was 10 cubits, then the circumference should have been 31.415926 cubits, and not just 30 cubits! Any math student will tell you that the circumference of a circle is found by taking the diameter times Pi (3.14159265358979…), is commonly approximated by 22/7 if great accuracy is not needed. Is this an error? Think again. The answer is so simple!

The diameter of 10 cubits is from outer rim to outer rim, the way anyone would measure a circular object. The circumference of 30 cubits, however, was of the inner circle, after subtracting the thickness of the brass (two handbreadths&#8212;one for each side) from which the bowl was made. This would be the number needed to calculate the volume of water.

the house of pi

line of thirty cubits did compass it round about

calculation of pi =

(30 x 18) / [(10 x 18) - (2 x 4.05)] = 540 / (180 - 8.10) = 3.1413613 = 3.1414

Let's compare our calculated value of 3.1414 to the real value of "pi", which is 3.1415927. Actually, the parameters given in 1 Kings 7:23-26 gives a direct value for "pi" that is within 2 parts in 10,000, which is fairly accurate. Since the outside diameter of the sea is 10 cubits, what is the inside diameter?

inside diameter = circumference / pi = 30 / 3.1415927 = 9.5493 cubits

And, since the inside circumference is 30 cubits, what is the outside circumference?

outside circumference = diameter x pi = 10 x 3.1415927 = 31.4159 cubits.

God makes no mistakes, mathematical or otherwise. The Scriptures do not contain error. By the way, Solomon built this sea in 1000 B.C., long before the Greeks rediscovered Pi (p). We may not understand some things at first glance, but the problem is with us, not with the Bible.
Ancient standards of measure vary widely, a cubit is generally taken to be about 18 inches, although there are different types of cubits ("common" and "royal", varying from 17 to 22 inches). A handbreadth is taken to be about 3 inches, sometimes being defined as one-sixth of a cubit.

deleted this part too: I will not stoop to your level.

thats just your interpretation, i interpret it another way.


as yakman
well done, you can use google to find someone who fiddled with the numbers until they worked.

Edit: ..

From: pwnaz0r

what have you done?

1. Given me one answer for something you think is true about evolution, which was disproven. (You said something like, I have told you a million times about the fossil record, which I seriously doubt you have researched it as much as me, and yes I can say that, seeing as you have made me very mad with threads like this…)
2. Made a joke of a post like this, which was quickly dis proven by one of my favorite sites to deal with people like you who think they know everything. I am truly disgusted and you should be embarrassed, which I hope you are. This is truly a step to far. You tried to make fun of the Bible and God, as a joke and you lost. gf.

The point in this thread was not to just make a joke because he felt like it. That may be part of it, but I think that he mostly wanted people to not believe everything the bible tells them without questioning it.

hahahah THAT MUST BE TRUE, GOD SAID IT!

EDIT: have been informed by certain people who's opinion is dear to me that my posts were out of line. I will not stoop to the level of you Yakman.

From: God
I am God, I say pi is 3!

…so?
Lies.

From: Yakman
My name is Yakman and I am communist! I say pi is 3!

Aha, ok, sure, superduper, yep, ya, yoohoo, true.
I BELIEVE!

Anyways, to you Yakman…
People are currently (unless I misunderstood everything…) throwing flames at you for this (*NOTE SARCASM*) unintentional accusation of believing in God and contradicting God at the same time.
But Yakman, my humble opinion is…
THUMBS UP!

You know I love caricature, and I'd count this as one. A good one, at that.

I believe caricature to be the most powerful way of making people aware of something. Blankly pointing out may just cause the person-in-need-of-an-eye-opener to say "So?". Heavy exaggeration will open eyes, even unwillingly!

I, being a selfproclaimed Master of Caricature, find this to be awesome.

If you hate this, please see the humor (AND THE LIGHT!).

Yakman, I'm gonna give this 2 shared communist-thumbs up.
Let me know if you need a MS Pain(t) artist!

-Knives

Can you please actually contribute something? Like Yakman

I have deleted all of my posts, only because of the reason above (Bob). However, I find it amusing you pick on me Yakman, no one else. I never did anything to you, I made my case never confronted you, you confronted me. Then you proceed to act like this is some kind of joke? I hope someday, that you will relealize you were always beaten, that you could never respond to even one of my points intellectually, or counter any of my "disassemblings" of your belief. I can't bring anything else to the table. That's all you can do so, you know if it makes you feel good to continue to believe that your right, good for you. It's obviously not getting through to you, so I will move on now to someone who actually has the ability to reason and will excersize that ability, AKA someone who cares about what's really right.

By the properties of god(s) pi = 3 but by the properties of LSD pi = (dosage of LSD ingested(in mL(hopefully this is a decimal))/body weight * (plus or minus) the square root of your age + blue - fishes)

I think this whole thread is just a funny tongue-in-cheek satire from Yakman. Being someone who believes firmly in science, I find the whole thing quite funny. For anyone wondering, no I'm not an Atheist, so let's not start those lines of discussion.

I just find it funny that the Christians I meet in life just love to try to get you into the bible, no matter how much you tell them you're not interested. And yet, when Yakman does something mildly satirical to attempt to share his views of the whole matter, everyone's in a hissy fit.

I dunno, I think everyone just needs to calm down. For every Christian out there trying to say this, that, or the other thing, there's going to be someone like Yak with their own views. Deal with it folks.

Black thursday.

I respect your response, yet this isn't just a funny thing he made up. I am insulted (under the rug of course)through out the whole thread. Its things that I have said and he adapts to himself, such as being a developer and he is not stupid. I said that about my master's cup, just things like that.

No one got into a hissy fit, (well i did but i deleted it), but in this forum, although I am 100% full fledged Christian, make no mistake of that, I argue of for Intelligent Design which is the use of science to prove an intellegent designer.

And that's the point. I never even brought up the Bible, and that's the funny part. And I believe I have won that, or as far as the responses go, because he did respond after that, so I assume he has given up on it (he did not post anything against it) I merely defended it.

I personally believe that any person that thinks evolution is true is uninformed, honestly. Now will that make some people mad yes. But I have been made mad so many times. Thats what I try to prove, and have proved as far as the realm of science goes (that atheists are uninformed) Now as far as personal accountability on this matter, some choose not to accept the things I put out there, however I will not be mocked by Yakman, someone I have never seen, know, or anyone, and from personal experience so far, I can say cannot adequately back his reasoning.


One more thing just to you. You make it sound like them getting you into the Bible is like trying to get you to buy a car or something. Christians only try to do this because they care about you as a person, and even if you don't want to even look into it, you should at least have the respect to let them know your thankful, but you're just not ready to believe in it. Honestly, that's what makes me mad, because that's all I've tried to do. It's hard when you in a debate to keep it on a friendly level and not be passionate about it, but ultimately all I have tried to do is arm my self with knowledge that will help you in the end, even if you don't believe it, that's the reason I argue about this. In my own way, I am just another person, trying to help you see what I see, that the world is corrupt, it's not just this perfect place where everyone is out there to help you. You have to explore things for yourself to find out true meaning, and I think some (like Yakman) don't do this or just don't care. So what do they do? They make threads like this, making fun of the people that tried to help them, even if you don't think it will, that's all I was trying to do, religion or no religion, God or no God. Anyways, I don't appreciate it being responded to as such, and that's why I'm done with Yakman on this.

From: BlackThursday
I think this whole thread is just a funny tongue-in-cheek satire from Yakman. Being someone who believes firmly in science, I find the whole thing quite funny. For anyone wondering, no I'm not an Atheist, so let's not start those lines of discussion.

I just find it funny that the Christians I meet in life just love to try to get you into the bible, no matter how much you tell them you're not interested. And yet, when Yakman does something mildly satirical to attempt to share his views of the whole matter, everyone's in a hissy fit.

I dunno, I think everyone just needs to calm down. For every Christian out there trying to say this, that, or the other thing, there's going to be someone like Yak with their own views. Deal with it folks.

Yeah, but when someone obviously misinterperates it in order to attack it, is a logical fallacy. A.K.A. the "Straw Man" fallacy, where you take something and twist it to what you want it to say, and then attack what you said it is (almost like putting words in someones mouth)

Pathetic. Lost all forms of respect for Yakman.

wow looks like a lot of people lost respect for yakman

BTW pretty much pointless thread, no idea why you want to discuss math vs religion

Yakman… If you do not believe in god then GET OVER DISING OTHER PEOPLES beliefs , respect other people beliefs , i thought you where more responsable then this..

I have nothing against christians or atheist. I, myself, am an atheist, but most of my family believes in God (More or less, of course).

So I have nothing against anybody, but hating yakman for this seems to be quite an overkill, in my opinion.

This is a satirical caricature, and it's not meant as any personal attack.

Communists are nice people

-Knives

From: King of Knives
I have nothing against christians or atheist. I, myself, am an atheist, but most of my family believes in God (More or less, of course).

So I have nothing against anybody, but hating yakman for this seems to be quite an overkill, in my opinion.

This is a satirical caricature, and it's not meant as any personal attack.

Communist are nice people.

-Knives

I see it as a direct attack on Pwnaz0r, as all of Yakman's points have been completely broken down to the core.

Yakman tells us to have open minds, yet he's the one that doesn't accept any new ideas. Hypocrite.

as yakman

i find it quite funny how the theists are acting like children.


if you ever go into politics, you will have you beliefs challenged, thats for certain,
you can have a nice political debate, where many things get thrashed out and no-one goes away feeling offended.

you also get satires and caricatures published in newspapers,
perhaps you'll see george bush with a cabbage for a head,
or tony blair with very large ears.

if you're a politician, its expected


however, if you try the same thing with religion, people go crying, running to their mothers, moaning about how we're not allowed to offend people, how their feelings have been hurt.


remember when Obama and McCain are debating, McCain says "Obama is a stupid, he cannot possibly remove the troops from iraq!"
Obama isnt going to break down and start crying in rage, demanding an apology and threatening lawsuits.



you should also look at reviews for restaurants.
"This restaurant had the worse food I've ever eaten, not just worse by a little bit, but worst by a long long way"

"It was the worst thing I had since i ate worms at school"

compared to this, my thread looks tame and timid.


Religious beliefs are just like any other beliefs, they are nothing special, yet you are insisting we treat them as a no-go area, everything has to be checked to make sure it wont offend you.

you do realise that i could just make up a religion of my own, then whenever you say something, i could claim it offends me and not answer your question.






As for people saying "I've lost all respect for you", you've clearly just regurgitated what you heard from Bobarkinator.
And in either case, i don't care, I've never had much respect for you, i wouldn't expect you to respect me.

From: Bonfield
BTW pretty much pointless thread, no idea why you want to discuss math vs religion

And yet it makes sense to discuss science vs religion?

From: Santa_Clause
Yakman tells us to have open minds, yet he's the one that doesn't accept any new ideas. Hypocrite.

I accept new ideas, but i pass them through a firewall of critical thinking.

Also, i don't ever recall telling people to have open minds, (although i could be wrong) it seems a catchphrase of Pwnaz0r's.




there is one thing i would like to refute as well,

From: pwnaz0r
You make it sound like them getting you into the Bible is like trying to get you to buy a car or something. Christians only try to do this because they care about you as a person, and even if you don't want to even look into it, you should at least have the respect to let them know your thankful,

i see preachers standing on street corners, telling me i could be saved.
I've never met them before, nor they me, they have nothing to do with me,
they don't care for me, they want my money and my time, they want me to give until it hurts.

the way i see it,
rabies forces an unfortunate dog to find more dogs to bite. In the same way, religion forces the unfortunate human to find more humans to convert.

I find it very hard to be thankful to someone who wants to put a brain-virus in my head.




to be completely honest, i got bored repeating the same arguments to people who are almost programmed not to listen.
so i wrote this satire to make it a bit more interesting, it actually took me a lot longer to write then you might think.

From: pwnaz0r
Black thursday.

I respect your response, yet this isn't just a funny thing he made up. I am insulted (under the rug of course)through out the whole thread. Its things that I have said and he adapts to himself, such as being a developer and he is not stupid. I said that about my master's cup, just things like that.

No one got into a hissy fit, (well i did but i deleted it), but in this forum, although I am 100% full fledged Christian, make no mistake of that, I argue of for Intelligent Design which is the use of science to prove an intellegent designer.

And that's the point. I never even brought up the Bible, and that's the funny part. And I believe I have won that, or as far as the responses go, because he did respond after that, so I assume he has given up on it (he did not post anything against it) I merely defended it.

I personally believe that any person that thinks evolution is true is uninformed, honestly. Now will that make some people mad yes. But I have been made mad so many times. Thats what I try to prove, and have proved as far as the realm of science goes (that atheists are uninformed) Now as far as personal accountability on this matter, some choose not to accept the things I put out there, however I will not be mocked by Yakman, someone I have never seen, know, or anyone, and from personal experience so far, I can say cannot adequately back his reasoning.


One more thing just to you. You make it sound like them getting you into the Bible is like trying to get you to buy a car or something. Christians only try to do this because they care about you as a person, and even if you don't want to even look into it, you should at least have the respect to let them know your thankful, but you're just not ready to believe in it. Honestly, that's what makes me mad, because that's all I've tried to do. It's hard when you in a debate to keep it on a friendly level and not be passionate about it, but ultimately all I have tried to do is arm my self with knowledge that will help you in the end, even if you don't believe it, that's the reason I argue about this. In my own way, I am just another person, trying to help you see what I see, that the world is corrupt, it's not just this perfect place where everyone is out there to help you. You have to explore things for yourself to find out true meaning, and I think some (like Yakman) don't do this or just don't care. So what do they do? They make threads like this, making fun of the people that tried to help them, even if you don't think it will, that's all I was trying to do, religion or no religion, God or no God. Anyways, I don't appreciate it being responded to as such, and that's why I'm done with Yakman on this.

…..WOW. I hope that you realize that is the exact reason why people hate Christians in the first place and why Yakman is making fun of you. If you could take a joke instead of taking offence to everything you would realize that everyone but you is having a good laugh at this and none of it was going to be targeted at you before you got all serious over it.

Personally, I agree with Aser. It's because of the self-centered, narcissistic, and hypocritical n00bs that make people hate Christians. So, you don't need to go shoving your ideas around and saying things that will p$$ people off knowingly. Just read the thread. Post if you want to. If you don't like it. Opinnionate. Leave.

Don't take it personally, I'm a Christian and thats just my opinnion. …..

ps… my math teacher failed me because of this thread….

From: Yakman

i see preachers standing on street corners, telling me i could be saved.
I've never met them before, nor they me, they have nothing to do with me,
they don't care for me, they want my money and my time, they want me to give until it hurts.

Is that how they do it in Australia (correct me if I am wrong) ? And who are 'they' that want your money? It's not like if you believe in God or go to church that you HAVE to give offering. It is said in the bible to tithe but not many people do (my family does and we have never struggled with money, coinsidence? maybe).

From: Aser
…..WOW. I hope that you realize that is the exact reason why people hate Christians in the first place and why Yakman is making fun of you. If you could take a joke instead of taking offence to everything you would realize that everyone but you is having a good laugh at this and none of it was going to be targeted at you before you got all serious over it.

Dude Aser you're my hero. I love to fantasize about your manly physique. Just seeing your posts brightens my day. I encourage you to continue posting so that others can bask in your glow JUST LIKE ME. BELIEVE!

Wow Yakman, I love that rabies comparison!

I will have to remember that for future use.

From: HyperSecret
Dude Aser you're my hero. I love to fantasize about your manly physique. Just seeing your posts brightens my day. I encourage you to continue posting so that others can bask in your glow JUST LIKE ME. BELIEVE!

the difference is that i was attacking people's religious beliefs, you were attacking him personally.

ill take the Obama/McCain analogy again.

its the difference between Obama saying McCain has made a mistake with the troops being taken out of iraq, and Obama saying McCain is an old faggot who should go screw his own sister.


EDIT on 17/11/2008:
MY POST HAS BEEN TAMPERED WITH!



this is my version of events.
the quote from Hypersecret used to be much ruder, i suspect Hypersecret was ashamed, he edited his post, and asked tarajunky to edit mine.

to be honest, after his edited quote, my reply to it makes little sense…

Wow, HyperSecret, you are a moron.
leave Aser alone, that's no way of treating someone.
and he has not broken any rules either.

and rep ++ at the rabies part Yakman.

From: HyperSecret
Dude Aser you're my hero. I love to fantasize about your manly physique. Just seeing your posts brightens my day. I encourage you to continue posting so that others can bask in your glow JUST LIKE ME. BELIEVE!

Um… Thank you for that one, and no I'm not offended? I just want to say that was pretty much way over the line. I didn't realize I was offending people so far as to make them hate me. I am truely sorry that you feel the need to try to offend me and I make no apoligies for anything else.

Thank you guys for sticking up for me or whatever you want to call, but really it's not a big deal. I get insulted all the time. I don't get my feelings hurt easily. Only with sharp or pointy objects.

I find this topic has turned to little more than mud slinging.
Yakman was obviously playing the devil's advocate to start a religious debate. I agree some bits may have been a bit "harsh" or patronizing, but for the majority of those who took offense from that, they must have had worse thrown at them before and I found his attitude tame to what many others say and do. I fully agree with his idea of religious people being attacked complaining more compared to politicians. Of course I also take note that they are different groups of people, but I do not think of this as an excuse as from a young age people with religious beliefs are challenged and should be used to it by now. If you live in such a sheltered environment where as this is the most religiously offensive content you have seen, then you may want to grow a thicker skin.
You have truly only lost an argument when instead of throwing facts and persuasions you throw crap.

From: Yakman
the difference is that i was attacking people's religious beliefs, you were attacking him personally.

There is no difference. Religion and their belief is a part of them. If you attack my religion and calling it false, you are attacking me personally. I put them on the same level.

From: Aser
Um… Thank you for that one, and no I'm not offended? I just want to say that was pretty much way over the line. I didn't realize I was offending people so far as to make them hate me. I am truely sorry that you feel the need to try to offend me and I make no apoligies for anything else.

I don't hate you, I've never talked to you. I was just trying to get my point across. That what I said wasn't suppose to be offensive at all but you may have taken it offensive. I would imagine at some point of reading that last paragraph you were like 'fuck you hypersecret' or thought something of that nature.

No hard feelings at all ;) sorry to anyone that thought I was being serious. :duh: :( :redface: (that's a few smilies for me)

I feel a little ashamed (of myself) that people thought I was directing towards him.

From: HyperSecret
There is no difference. Religion and their belief is a part of them. If you attack my religion and calling it false, you are attacking me personally. I put them on the same level.

If you say that there is a god, then are you not calling his "religion" (his lack of religion, more like) false? Would that not mean you are attacking him personally?

(Also, yakman, I liked that rabies comparison a lot)

HAHA Aser. You slay me. I lost my whole post, pressed back (ha), but basically I might make a list just because everyone's like its just a joke. It's not and if you think it is, you need to stop replying to this thread. He attacked me personally, and if you don't know that, then you haven't even read the other threads here. The things he is saying are direct quotes from me, just sarcastic. All I ever did was prove him wrong in theology, science, and pschology, and he proceeds to personally attack me.

And Aser, quite frankly you were just as over the line as Hyper (minus the cussing). But no, WAIT. I forgot, your an atheist, your on the developer's side, so it's ok to do that. My bad. Sarcastic enough for you?

This thread doesn't make me mad, it makes me feel bad for the atheists who have to resort to this. it's wierd I actually feel sorry for those who ignore the facts.

It astounds me how many people say that. (Bows down and worships Yakman *looks to developer tag*). This isn't politics, its frustrating to me because you just won't listen and honestly, I don't see why? What more can I do? Science? beat you. Pschology? beat you. That's literally what I see it as, and being a thread where we aren't taking anything too seriously, you loose Yakman. What more can I give you. Although I do love the occasional radical *Aser cough* who doesn't seem to know anything but likes to get the "Yeah you get'em" post. Good job. I hope it insults you so you can laugh about it. Maybe Ill make a thread about it…

From: Yakman

they don't care for me, they want my money and my time, they want me to give until it hurts.

You say you've read the Bible, but apparently you didn't understand it. That may be what they want from you, but that's not what God wants.

From: Yakman
It has come to my attention that millions of mathmaticans are lying to you!

they say pi is an irrational number!

So you believe pi is a never-ending number, approximately 3.14?
I did too at one point in my life, and i went to a good Christian school.

However i have since read the bible and seen the error of my ways, God is just, he forgave me and saved me. He can save you too. PWN: NEVER SAID THAT BUT OBVIOUSLY POINTED TOWARDS MY BACKGROUND

Please do not come to this thread with a closed mind!PWN: I SAID THIS MANY TIMES, JUST BECAUSE OF PEOPLE LIKE HIME

They didn't give me a developers cup for nothing! I said this to show that I'm not dumb, except I said masters In fact i know that Wizzup and Benland also believe pi is exactly 3, and there are many more! I said there are many smart people on this forum that believe in a God


The bible says that the mathematical constant pi is exactly 3

PWN: LIES. FUNNY, DISPROVED HIM ON THIS, SO THIS WHOLE THREAD IS A JOKE ALRIGHT, BUT ITS NOT ON ME ANYMORE.



so there was a circle, with diameter 10 units and circumference 30 units.
=> 30 = pi * 10
=> pi = 3
God say it! it must be true!PWN: I NEVER SAID THIS, I DONT KNOW WHERE HE GOT THIS, NEVER ONCE USED THE BIBLE IN A DEBATE AGAINST ATHIESTS, FIND IT KINDA FUNNY HE RESORTS TO IT NOT ME

There is absolutely no mention of the idea that pi is irrational.
PWN: I SAID THERE IS NO EVIDENCE THAT PROVES THERE IS NOT A GOD

who are these evil, homosexual, terrorist mathematicians, thinking they can improve on God's work?PWN: I POINTED OUT THAT SCIENTISTS DO LIE FOR MONEY, WHICH THEY HAVE. HE MIGHT JUST BE MAD ABOUT IT
PI == IRRATIONAL, IS JUST A THEORY



These mathematicians keep changing their minds! they are clearly running around like a chicken with its head cut off.

First, they said pi was equal to 22/7
then they changed their minds, so it was 3.15
the theory keeps on changing, when will it end?

its clearly a theory in crisis.

PWN: HE TRIED TO MIMICK ME HERE, PROBLEM IS HE DID A VERY POOR JOB. EVOLUTIONISTS ALWAYS CHANGE THEIR MIND

you might hear of a 'mathematician' called Leibniz who came up with a mathematical series to calculate pi, it seems all well and good, until you give it a moments thought.
Leibniz was found to be a fake, he doctored his forumlas, mislead the public.

PWN: ALLUSIONS TO HAECKEL'S DRAWINGS, WHICH IS COMPLETELY TRUE, SO ALSO FIND IT FUNNY ALL HE CAN DO IT TRY TO MAKE FUN OF IT, NO FACTS AGAINST IT

So my point is, there are evil mathematicians who will lie to you!
think about it, whats to stop them? they can say whatever they want.
they just want to be rich and famous, they have no morals to guide them.

MY POINT AGAINST SCIENTISTS. THEY MAY NOT DO IT ON PURPOSE, BUT ITS BEEN DONE TO MANY TIMES BEFORE, DONT JUST TAKE THEIR WORD ON THINGS, THEY USE A TON OF PRESSUPPOSITIONS

someone give me one fact, just one fact about pi == irrational.

PWN: I SAY THIS ALL THE TIME. NEVER GOTTEN A VALID ANSWER ABOUT IT BY THE WAY. ONLY ONE POST BY YAKMAN, WHO CLAIMS TO HAVE PROOF BUT NEVER SHOWS IT HAHA. IVE GOTTEN USED TO IT…

you might point to a so-called 'proof' by someone called Niven,
but Niven recanted on his deathbed!, he was dying, he was afraid to go to hell, and admitted that his proof was all wrong, and pi was actually 3. PWN: ALLUSION TO DARWIN, WHICH I TALKED ABOUT, THIS IS HOW HE SAID THE FOSSIL RECORD WOULD BAIL HIM OUT, WHICH IT NEVER HAS.



I propose we Teach the Controversy, children need to learn the art of debate, they need to hear both sides of the story. MAKING FUN OF MY IDEA THAT RATIONAL BEING CAN DETERMINE FOR THEMSELVES, AND NOT HAVE OTHERS DO IT FOR THEM?

In fact, the most famous mathematician Glen Greaves(no less) from Harvard (no less) agreed.
MAKES FUN OF ME USING MICHAEL BEHE, WHICH I FIND QUITE FUNNY.

You guys should all read your bibles to see the truth! PWN: AGAIN, AN ALLUSION TO ME, BUT NOT ABOUT BIBLE. I JUST SAID FIND OUT FOR YOURSELVES.

And don't quote from wikipedia because that is an extremely BIAS website written by COMMUNISTS!
PWN: I SAID THIS BECAUSE ITS TRUE. YOUR NOT ALLOWED TO USE IT FOR PAPERS, OR AT LEAST IM NOT, SO WHY DOES THAT CHANGE WHEN RELIGION IS INVOLVED.

So basically everything in red is making fun of me, which I have all the evidence in the world, so I don't know what he is doing making fun of me. Any questions those who say he wasn't???

EDIT: So, there is one sentence in here that is not making fun of me. here it is

So you believe pi is a never-ending number, approximately 3.14?

its kind of hard to beat someone at proving a moot point. If someone was beaten (assuming it isnt a moot point) i would say it was you. *me looks to the end of your first thread and your second thread*

This is a picture of the Prime Minister of the United Kingdom


OMG they are personal attacks on the head of state! this is outrageous!
The Times newspaper personally attacked him, and if you don't see that, then you should stop posting in this thread.



pwnaz0r, listen to yourself speak, you sound ridiculous.



you haven't actually beat me at anything,

i say something, then you go off on a tangent, then i say it again, then you go off on a tangent.
after a while i just give up, since its clear you're deaf to things which you don't agree with.

If you ever look at a presidential debate, both sides will always say they won. Its just how debates work.


the first time you read this thread, that was probably the first time you listened to me, since it appeared that i was saying things you agreed with.

From: Yakman


This is a picture of the Prime Minister of the United Kingdom


OMG they are personal attacks on the head of state! this is outrageous!
The Times newspaper personally attacked him, and if you don't see that, then you should stop posting in this thread.



pwnaz0r, listen to yourself speak, you sound ridiculous.



you haven't actually beat me at anything,

i say something, then you go off on a tangent, then i say it again, then you go off on a tangent.
after a while i just give up, since its clear you're deaf to things which you don't agree with.

If you ever look at a presidential debate, both sides will always say they won. Its just how debates work.


the first time you read this thread, that was probably the first time you listened to me, since it appeared that i was saying things you agreed with.

Yeah, but I agreed with you. And the funny this is, now I don't I still listened to you. Show me one instance, I always try to answer . But you listen to me, I handle that far more than you, and this debate forum is not my life, and you are not the only person I have to deal with so I'm honestly sorry, but I have never seen one thing that you have beaten me at, unlike you I actually give examples, and evidence. you state things as though they are fact with nothing to prove. Some things you have never even discussed because you know they are wrong?

1. Fine tunings of the universe, you can't refute it so you don't touch it.
2. Irreducible complexity. You may not even know what that means, so you refute it.
3. Cambrian explosion, you don't touch it.
4. Chance - you probably can't understand the chance, so you don't touch it. (I even could add that I don't either but I actually admit it, and I think that you should know this is exactly what you do to me, so from now on I'll leave out little details like that to make you feel better).
5. The complexity of a cell, DNA, and enzymes, that seem to have life but are not alive?
6. The complexity of the atoms, all the different quarks, how you and I don't explode and cause the whole world to fall apart, how the electron paths are so intricate, lining up in a certain order.
7. Modern morals and values, atheists love this one, like "if God is good, etc." and "why is there pain" etc. I have answered all of them, you atheists seem to think He's some kind of genie by the way. You have never answered one like "Where do morals come from" and "Why do my thoughts conflict social Darwinism" and "We are not the most advanced species, why are we at the top of the food chain(intellectually speaking). We have nothing that would help us (according to Darwin), such as talons, beaks, etc.
8. Is man imperfect. ( and I will play an atheists game here ). Why are human's so bad. Why did we make the world like this. Why if we want to be good, do we allow these things to happen.
9. Why is ok scientists can be wrong and improve their theories, however evolutionists think this is some sort of weak spot. The Bible never says the Earth is flat, and I have never once seen a lie, or a miscalculation, as I proved about 2 pages ago. People that think they have found them are as silly as the accusations themselves.
10. Why do you depend on a theory that I see as having no scientific fact. The theory is only as good as its facts.

Ok, so you do what I do everyday, and At least write a paragraph on each of these, then fight off people who won't listen to perfectly sound logic, then I'll make a thread about you on here making fun of you, and everyone will be on my side. Seriously, I would like you to answer them the best you can. Go for it, and see what I have to go through, without complaining(until things like this thread occur), since i started here at SRL. Try it.

i don't respond to those things cause they are completely stupid, they just make me /facepalm

like that irreducible complexity thing, you just say it exists! believe it!
how about you give us examples of some bacteria that is irreducibly complex?

how about you try to say "the human eye is irreducibly complex, if you took away one part, the whole thing falls apart"


and the fine-tunings on the universe, "the gravitational constant is finely tuned, if it moved by 0.000001 of a meter, the universe would not expand"


it seems like you're the one who doesnt understand it, i strongly suspect you read answersingenesis then just repeat the long words you saw because they seem impressive.

ditto everything else


like that thing about electrons moving around.
didn't you ever go to school?
they are negatively charged, they are attracted to the positive nucleus, its exactly the same as planets orbiting, except the force that keeps them there is electromagnetism instead of gravity.

it makes the electrons move in a way that seems "perfect" to us humans, but its just the more stable state.
moving in circles is more stable then moving in triangles or squares…



but i expect this from you, you've shown in the "weaknesses of evolution" thread that you have almost no understanding of science.

From: pwnaz0r


And Aser, quite frankly you were just as over the line as Hyper (minus the cussing). But no, WAIT. I forgot, your an atheist, your on the developer's side, so it's ok to do that. My bad. Sarcastic enough for you?

From: pwnaz0r

It astounds me how many people say that. (Bows down and worships Yakman *looks to developer tag*). This isn't politics, its frustrating to me because you just won't listen and honestly, I don't see why? What more can I do? Science? beat you. Pschology? beat you. That's literally what I see it as, and being a thread where we aren't taking anything too seriously, you loose Yakman. What more can I give you. Although I do love the occasional radical *Aser cough* who doesn't seem to know anything but likes to get the "Yeah you get'em" post. Good job. I hope it insults you so you can laugh about it. Maybe Ill make a thread about it…

Well, thank you; yes I am getting a very good laugh over this. As to the part of me not reading all of your replies I am sorry but it seems to me that somebody deleted all of their posts when they got mad at the thread.


Also just because I don't believe in Christianity (or is it Christianity) does not make me an atheist. You think that you get your religion bashed just try being a Pagan. Then everybody hates you not just the atheists and the Muslims.

I wasn't just following Yakman's developer tag and I do know the facts. I know that Christians follow a 2000-year-old book that was written by a counsel of Roman leaders. I know that Jesus was a Jew. I know that there are religions that are way older and more thought through that Christianity. And I also know that when you have a large religion (not just Christianity but Islam, Buddhism, and the Hebrews (and lots of others) there are people who don't understand that sometimes maybe your beliefs don't supercede the beliefs of others. We are all free to believe what we want (unless you're in a communist nation or one under control of a fascist regime). And if you truly believe
that I am wrong then feel free to. I'm not judging whether you are or not, I'm just saying…What happened to turning the other cheek?

P.S. go ahead and flame me, that was my final response.
EDIT: but I would enjoy the flame Aser thread P.M. me a link to it please.

Can't you see this fighting is tearing us appart?!?!????!!!!!

Only certain thing that's been proven in all the arguments in the world about a god is that arguments about god create war. You can see it right here in this thread :)

I have nothing against, "the god of sun", or those kinds of gods, those things I find quite fascinating, but one single god that sadly a crapload of people talk about like "omg praise the lord! jesus will save us" sure isn't the one for me…

lolwut.

Everyone knows Pi isn't constant…

Sometimes Pi = Apple. Other times Pi = Strawberry Rhubarb.

In other words, coexist. Take a joke.

Dude 22/7 is fucking 3.142857… just accept it. :)


Programs> Accessories> Calculator. Then type "22 / 7". :P

From: n3ss3s
Only certain thing that's been proven in all the arguments in the world about a god is that arguments about god create war. You can see it right here in this thread :)

Isn't that what I just said¿ Truly though… Kahlua Cream is one of my favorites… and by the way 22/7 does not equal pi.

From: Aser
Well, thank you; yes I am getting a very good laugh over this. As to the part of me not reading all of your replies I am sorry but it seems to me that somebody deleted all of their posts when they got mad at the thread.


Also just because I don't believe in Christianity (or is it Christianity) does not make me an atheist. You think that you get your religion bashed just try being a Pagan. Then everybody hates you not just the atheists and the Muslims.

I wasn't just following Yakman's developer tag and I do know the facts. I know that Christians follow a 2000-year-old book that was written by a counsel of Roman leaders. I know that Jesus was a Jew. I know that there are religions that are way older and more thought through that Christianity. And I also know that when you have a large religion (not just Christianity but Islam, Buddhism, and the Hebrews (and lots of others) there are people who don't understand that sometimes maybe your beliefs don't supercede the beliefs of others. We are all free to believe what we want (unless you're in a communist nation or one under control of a fascist regime). And if you truly believe
that I am wrong then feel free to. I'm not judging whether you are or not, I'm just saying…What happened to turning the other cheek?

P.S. go ahead and flame me, that was my final response.
EDIT: but I would enjoy the flame Aser thread P.M. me a link to it please.

You obviously do not know the history of the New Testament. It was not written by a "counsil of roman leaders" no not in the least. They happened to be Roman Citizens, it was written by the desciples and there are some books who's authors are unknown. Take a world religion course.

Hebrews? Again, you obviously know very little about the Christian Bible. The "Torah" (that is the Jewish Bible) is what is known as the "Old Testament" so, Christianity in some respects is just as old as the Jewish faith. The difference is the "New Testament" which is a finishing of the "Old Testament". The Hebrews are still looking for the Messiah who, Christians believe has already came.

Islam is actually a expansion of Christianity. They do not fully accept Christianity but they say the New Testament is viable, except for Jesus being more than a prophet. Although the Quaran is quite different from the Bible… Seriously, take come kind of course before opening your mouth. Or in this case, moving your fingers ;)

I find this whole thread rediculous and trying to mock the Bible by taking something too literally and out of context is just rediculous. I will stay out of this discussion as it is offending. I doubt you would like for me to make a thread "OMG THE MISSING LINK(s) HAVE BEEN FOUND!!!"

3.14 = PI.

Globally renowned symbol.

End of story.

xD

From: sirlaughsalot
I find this whole thread rediculous and trying to mock the Bible by taking something too literally and out of context is just rediculous.

Christianity seems to be built on people taking the Bible too literally.

Christianity basically depends on people taking literalism too far.