SRL Archive - Discussions and Debates

Shocker (former SRL-dev) once made a sound detection plug-in, that nobody really got working.

But, now the SRL-community is big, and we have lots of talent on board, so I am going to ask this question again: does anyone here have the knowledge to make me a sound-detection plugin?

All it needs to do is capture the sound-output of runescape. This will be compared to predefined wavetables of rs-sounds. I dont think it is that hard to make, but I sadly dont have enough application/platform knowledge to device such a system.

Or nielsie(i think) not so long ago made a function that would check the music tab and would compare it to a list and it would tell you where you were. It was pretty sweet.

Edit: Here's a link http://www.srl-forums.com/forum/getlocation-t12678.html

From: bobarkinator
Or nielsie(i think) not so long ago made a function that would check the music tab and would compare it to a list and it would tell you where you were. It was pretty sweet.

Edit: Here's a link http://www.srl-forums.com/forum/getlocation-t12678.html

hes talking about a plugin not a script. It naeds to be able to record, extract and convert a single sound then identify it through scar. So flawless mining, fishing and antirandom detection could be developed.

e.g

If(FindSound(pickaxehit))then Mining:= true;

something like that.

Ah, my mouth was faster than my mind. All I thought about was location identifying. Yes this is a great idea.

And freddy does not have the knowledge to do this? It would take a little research but if you have the basics of scripting, you can almost anything when you have the resources.

I think it was supposed to be in Scar Divi, But it didnt work too well, so freddy removed it. Fakawi: Maybe you should ask freddy he probably knows something.

I don't have the knowledge to make this. It's a great idea though. I'll do some research and see if there's anything I can come up with.

I don't mean to rain on your parade or anything, but you hear other people's sounds, this has only been so a few months after Shocker released his sound detection plugin. It would only be useful in the remotest of places guaranteed no one will visit.

Yea, personally i don't feel sound detection is the way forward.

Maybe if we can manage to use some sort of voice recognition system? I believe those systems use a neural network, a network which can be "trained" to recognize things. Ben has made such a network for his box solver, I believe. Though I'm not sure if can be done with sound. I think Benland can give you more info about it.

From: The Un-Named
I don't mean to rain on your parade or anything, but you hear other people's sounds, this has only been so a few months after Shocker released his sound detection plugin. It would only be useful in the remotest of places guaranteed no one will visit.

You can turn off sound effects or gamemusic.

@Fakawi: Do you have the source of the plugin?

From: The Un-Named
I don't mean to rain on your parade or anything, but you hear other people's sounds, this has only been so a few months after Shocker released his sound detection plugin. It would only be useful in the remotest of places guaranteed no one will visit.

You can switch off other peoples sound (environment). So you only hear your own sounds. You only need the first 100 msec to discriminate a sound. Lets presume a samplerate of 48kHz, this means an array of max 4800 entries. Sound detection has a great number of advantages, a few come to mind:

• Knowing if you are actually attacking a monster and when you kill it.
• Knowing if you are mining.
• Knowing if you are under attack.
• Thieving and failure.

Basically all actions (and failure) invoke a certain sound. Detecting and parsing these could proove very usefull for enhanced autoing.

this far i found some sound comperison functions in delphi but nothing that can get a sound from a handle:(

Very nice idea, lots of potential here. Have you thought about using Java to determine if a sound is being sent? I dont know much about Java, or the client for that matter, but I'm assuming that whenever an action that would invoke a sound is made, it would send a command to the client, telling it to play that sound, which we could be able to read using reflection. But then again thats java, and we dont like that here.

Can SCAR get sounds before they go to the speakers? Just like it can get colors before they go to the monitor.

I will also do some research to see what I can find and Fakawi that plugin source would be helpful if you're willing to give it out.

This would make stuff as combatdetection for autofighter SOOOOO much easier, also you could recognize the place you are near, such as river running etc.

From: bobarkinator
Can SCAR get sounds before they go to the speakers? Just like it can get colors before they go to the monitor.

I will also do some research to see what I can find and Fakawi that plugin source would be helpful if you're willing to give it out.

what do you mean before they get to the speakers? scar would just get whatever the sound card outputs, like it gets whatever the gfx card outputs (with a few tweaks or something so it can see under the mouse). Im not 100% on this but I think this is how it would work, judging by how other stuff works

but physically, yes..it would get it a lot faster before the speakers output the sound, seeing as the electrons have a long way to go, from the back of the sound card up the wire to the speaker, rather than just back into the processor. unless its all sequential, and the signals are sent to the speakers first. :D

I could give it a shot… I dunno if my crappy skillz will be enough though ;)

Freddy := Amazing. Do that shit. It would be awesome to see someone make this work. I dont even know where I would start to look for the sound, let alone actually "hear" it. Of course, it would still work with the speakers off right? :p. It would be really annoying to auto with the speakers on.

Yeh, it would work with speakers off.

ok, good :)

You guys made me interested… Catching sounds before they are out putted. This can proabably be done with any high level language.

(Goes and buys Delphi for Idiots)

" if(AndrewIsGoingToBathroom)then ListenToHisShowerSinging"

From: n3ss3s
" if(AndrewIsGoingToBathroom)then ListenToHisShowerSinging"

then start autoing;
if(AndrewIsBack)then
stop autoing while antiban;


^^

This seems like a good start…
Visual basic 6, not Delphi, but w/e…

http://pscode.com/vb/scripts/ShowCode.asp?txtCodeId=65662&lngWId=1

I don't have time too actually do anything with it. First week of school…

From: The_Rs_Monkey
This seems like a good start…
Visual basic 6, not Delphi, but w/e…

http://pscode.com/vb/scripts/ShowCode.asp?txtCodeId=65662&lngWId=1

I don't have time too actually do anything with it. First week of school…

Nice but the plugin can't be in VB, it has to be in delphi (if I'm right) unless someone made a VB converter.

Could be done in C++, though.

And through C++, you should be able to import the VB, no?

This'd be pretty sweet if it worked well.

From: Smartzkid
Could be done in C++, though.

And through C++, you should be able to import the VB, no?

This'd be pretty sweet if it worked well.

Why would you have to port to VB? You can port to SCAR.

i found this-http://un4seen.com/ then go to bass-and im not sure its what u need but from what i understand u can take the output and then use it how u want, so there might be a way turn something like this into scar…not saying it will work, just wondering if it could help

I did a lot of googling for intercepting audio output, and it doesn't look good. There is a lot on computer vision, but not hearing. Someone asked on the java forum and its not possible. The only way would be to use bcel/reflection to detect what sound the client is playing. I hope to be wrong.

How is delphi at reading .wmv files? Surely you could find a program to record sound coming from the sound card to a .wmv or .mp3 file.

If you found a program like that couldn't someone just look at what that program uses to do it?

If that was done would the SRL folder size not get a little bit too big? I mean.. theres a hell of alot of sounds in RS.

Everything I found seems to record from the mic, not intercept the soundcard output.

From: ~alex~
If that was done would the SRL folder size not get a little bit too big? I mean.. theres a hell of alot of sounds in RS.

Nope. I think we need no more then the first 10 msec at most, which is 480 samples @ samplerate 48kHz/16 bits. thats approx the same size as a 20* 20 bitmap. Bis yes, but not huge.

First we will need a small application that allows you to record a sound from RS, setting a threshhold, cut it to the desired length and save it. That is not complicated. I believe the German freeware driver ASIO4All allows for patching of sound, but I havent had the time to look into that. I can also use my Studio to sample some of rs sounds.

Second we need an SCAR plugin that listens to the sound-port and intercepts all incoming data. This will need to be compared to the prerecorded sounds and voila.

It is by no means the intention to sample all rs-sounds, just the ones you need for your script, plus maybe some other common sounds, like hit, miss, deadmonster, dwarfwhistle, minerock, opendoor to name just a few.

I hope I wont be flamed since Im gonna talk about KYAB; but anyways,
a) Can Java be used for that
b) If can, then couldnt we make app like KYAB, which instead just catches the sounds, then, same ways as KYAB sends data to SCAR, it would send the info of the sounds to SCAR?

Boreas already suggested BCEL/Reflection and I don't think it's going to be done ;)

well benland already started on the comparison, so i assume that means he knows a way how to get the sound aswel :p

Wait guys maybe this mgiht help us

we want to record sound not from a mic but from the actual screen right?

so maybe some links might help:

http://www.thesilver.net/

Bulent's Screen Recorder (BSR) : Captures video, sound and pictures of anything you see on your screen. Any part of the screen or a window or the entire desktop can be recorded. Record your web cam sessions, favorite games, any software on your desktop, any video display on your screen, record audio of what you hear from your speakers… Includes Movie and Photo Studios!

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http://www.etrusoft.com/screen-recorder/

!Quick Screen Recorder (version 1.5)

Quick Screen Recorder is a video screen capture, screen recording tool used for recording screen activity into standard AVI video files. If you move the cursor, launch a new program, type some text, click a few buttons, or select some menus – anything that you see on your screen – Quick Screen Recorder will be able to record all these and even the sound.

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http://www.deskshare.com/msr.aspx

My Screen Recorder captures your PC desktop activity into standard AVI video files. It records anything you see on the computer screen, including the entire desktop, windows, menus, cursors—even video with sound.


Seeing is believing! Demonstrate a product, create a presentation with your own audio narration, make a tutorial, or walk through a web site review.

Record a part of the screen or the entire desktop with My Screen Recorder. The program creates high-quality, small-size files. My Screen Recorder organizes your recordings using user-controlled Folder Shortcuts for easy management.


The ability to play back a recording of what happened on the screen helps you to communicate clearly and quickly. My Screen Recorder is vital to anyone who needs to demonstrate, share, teach, or explain.

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http://www.any-sound-recorder.com/

Any Sound Recorder - Record, Edit, Convert audio MP3 WAV music file.


Want to record and edit any sound on your PC or convert music files from MP3 to WAV? We've got the voice record software you need. With Any Sound Recorder at your fingertips, there's nothing on your computer that you can't capture to MP3, WAV, OGG music files with a few clicks.

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or just a list of some screen recorders (note = some aren't what we are looking for)

http://www.programurl.com/software/screen-recorder.htm


I'm not sure that's useful but maybe we could use those programs with scar or learn how they do it?

Very nice list Hugo, hopefully we can use one of those.

IDK if you all know this, but recording from windows is easy, the same code that records from the mic line can be made to record from the wave buffer, line in, speaker out, etc. Essentially sampling everything played on the speakers is no problem.

From: BenLand100
IDK if you all know this, but recording from windows is easy, the same code that records from the mic line can be made to record from the wave buffer, line in, speaker out, etc. Essentially sampling everything played on the speakers is no problem.

oh but in what language? delphi?

Hugo, you can do it in many languages. Delphi, C++, VB…

Forget what I said before, I suck at googling and forgot Ben is a robot.

Ben is not just a robot, he is history of machines :D

Only thing I see happening bad is having two sounds happening at the same time, shouldn't happen if you turn off background processes.

You mean from another program on your computer? Just have a failsafe to exit if it doesn't match a list.

From: TOB
Only thing I see happening bad is having two sounds happening at the same time, shouldn't happen if you turn off background processes.

Or, just check the mp3 and/or midi channels. I'm sure I could come up with a tolerance based sound comparison. Regardless, Fakawi knows more about sound that I do I'd be willing to bet :p

From: BenLand100
Or, just check the mp3 and/or midi channels. I'm sure I could come up with a tolerance based sound comparison. Regardless, Fakawi knows more about sound that I do I'd be willing to bet :p

If I'm right Fawki said he owns a studio… I would hope he knows more about sound than many of us would be willing to bet :D

Yea, you're right, this is in WTF's profile

Occupation:
Audiotechnician for Movies/T.V.

From: BenLand100
I exist outside of the bounds of time tyvm

i think that is why :duh:

Well, I played around a bit in delphi and found some sound components that may be usefull (for Freddy :D), the only thing I got working is Sound Comparision through VU level.. (it's a start :)).

note: it's still a stand alone app..

the problem is that it would be too easy to break.
colour does not work in waves in the same way sound does.
imagine a typical sine wave, pretend that is the sound of say… a monster dying.

it would be too easy for jagex to add in something that brings the top of the wave up by say, 2%, or makes the wavelength shorter by 2%. and unlike colours, making tolerances for sounds is extremely difficult.
with colour, each pixel is pretty much independant of the others. with sounds, the peak of a wave will affect the entire sound(see equalizers)

also, another thing jagex could do to break it is add some audio distortion.

From: elementalelf
the problem is that it would be too easy to break.
colour does not work in waves in the same way sound does.
imagine a typical sine wave, pretend that is the sound of say… a monster dying.

it would be too easy for jagex to add in something that brings the top of the wave up by say, 2%, or makes the wavelength shorter by 2%. and unlike colours, making tolerances for sounds is extremely difficult.
with colour, each pixel is pretty much independant of the others. with sounds, the peak of a wave will affect the entire sound(see equalizers)

also, another thing jagex could do to break it is add some audio distortion.

JageX doesn't care about SRL, we don't auto massively, and they have, IMO never taken any action in any of their updates against us.

that doesnt mean that they wont.
you should probably take into account every eventuality, not for any material reason other then longevity of scripters.
imagine, if you will, that we did manage to make this sound plugin, and it worked so well that absolutely EVERY new scripter started learning that as an intrinsic part of runescape cheating.
now jagex updates runescape to make the entire setup irretrievable. suddenly, nobody knows how to make real scripts anymore, most of the veterans from the time before the plugin will have probably left(as is ALWAYS the case) and then suddenly, the runescape cheating community goes dead, and 6 months to a year of scamming and keylogging etc etc will happen before there is another stable community.

"oh" you say "but that rendered the entire cheating program itself useless, if jagex makes an update to get rid of the plugin, we can all go back to the way it was before"
thats like saying that if SRL was suddenly rendered completely useless(hypothetical situation) then all scripters here would be able to go back to using basic clickmouse etc… and then jagex's auto bot detection comes into play :/

also, wizzup? you mentioned that jagex has never released an update against SRL…

the Anti-randoms, from when they first came out, to now, have been an attempt to stop all cheating, including SRL.
if jagex find a way to eliminate all the java bots(by, say, completely altering the java client so that it is unrecognisable), then surely their attention will turn towards the color picking bots eventually? we may only be a small problem for them, but we are still a problem
dont believe this might happen?
think about what happened after jagex released an update which encoded all of their packets, and autorune stopped working indefinitely. for the next(i cant remember the exact time period) almost every cheating community was full of scammers and keyloggers.

I can't see this building into anything more than a failsafe.

I think that people who say that Jagex doesn't care about SRL are being a little naive. Jagex doesn't like autoers. Period. I do think they have more of their attention on programs that rape RS, but they definitely don't want us around. People have arguments about the RS economy ect, but truly, I think jagex would like to see all cheating communities for RS gone…

From: bobarkinator
I can't see this building into anything more than a failsafe.

WEll to detect if you are mining etc it would be nice. Not really for music though. Ofcourse except to see if your in lummy.

@Wizzy i think you are forgetting about road color etc.

@Elemental i agree somewhat. ALthough if you look through shockers old plugin you will see that there is a tolerance based system.

To clarify the 'not caring about SRL' thing:

Yes that have made updates targeted at autoing. Duh.
Yes SRL is autoing. Duh.

But that doesn't mean they target SRL. Count up all the anti autoing updates. From those, count the ones that were a response to something that SRL uses that other autoing methods don't. Divide em an multiply by 100. What percent do you get? That's what we mean by being under jagex's radar. They target autoing as a whole, mostly for the ones that damage RS, which SRL doesn't. Of course they don't try to block the others and let SRL through, but they have bigger fish to fry.

That is to say, if SRL used sound, and other cheating methods didn't, it would be highly unlikely for jagex to update the sound so that it would break(or render unreliable) SRL's sound capabilities.

I think jagex is targetting us very MUCH!

See:
They updated the WHOLE rs looks, changed almost everything, gametabs, chat, we had to change almost everything, and were STILL in beta version, I'd say thats pretty much targetted at us!

Remember when they moved a bank pixel with 1 pixel! ONE PIXEL! just to make us update SRL!

They updated the trade window we had to update AGAIN!

They add MORE randoms all the time!

They changed varroks looks!

They updated gametab(5)!

of course alot more, most of this is probably just to make RS easier to play, But hellalot of work for us!

From: JuKKa
I think jagex is targetting us very MUCH!

See:
They updated the WHOLE rs looks, changed almost everything, gametabs, chat, we had to change almost everything, and were STILL in beta version, I'd say thats pretty much targetted at us!

Remember when they moved a bank pixel with 1 pixel! ONE PIXEL! just to make us update SRL!

They updated the trade window we had to update AGAIN!

They add MORE randoms all the time!

They changed varroks looks!

They updated gametab(5)!

of course alot more, most of this is probably just to make RS easier to play, But hellalot of work for us!

Moving the bank pixel 1 pixel seems like it is targeting us, but you ever think of reasons why it's possible their not targeting us (just an example, I'm sure there targeting all autos).
One reason for the bank pixel move is that they could of used hard coded coordinates for the bank text, but then they could of moved to a function that will center it directly in the center of that window. You never know…

I just think a sound detection system seems like the reward isn't worth the effort put in, like elf said, it sounds too simple to break.

it may be simple to break, but depending on how public it is(just membs, just dev, completely public) then how is jagex supposed to know that we're using sound detection?

if it breaks it would just be a matter of capturing the sounds again, it would be like filling in new coords….

From: iloveit8
if it breaks it would just be a matter of capturing the sounds again, it would be like filling in new coords….

Even if the sounds change during gameplay like colors? Can we do that? I don't really know SCAR's capabilities here.

@Jukka: If they changed this pixel every week, they would be targeting us.

function LoggedIn: Boolean;
begin
Result := (GetColor(439, 491) = 16777215);
end;

From: Pyro
WEll to detect if you are mining etc it would be nice. Not really for music though. Ofcourse except to see if your in lummy.

But their are other ways of doing that even if this would be the easiest one, so technically it's a failsafe. But my point was that if this was used people wouldn't forget how to script as elf said.

Well, the sort-of-system I got now could be usefull, even if they changed sound (I think)..
If you're mining you get a harder sound then normal (the "TICK" sound :p), even if they changed the sound it would still be a 'harder then normal' sound.. And could still be usefull to see if you're mining.

Other then that I did some more searching, and, I think, if we want a tol based system we should use some sort of Speech Recognizing.. I believe Windows has a build-in system.

From: The_Rs_Monkey
Moving the bank pixel 1 pixel seems like it is targeting us, but you ever think of reasons why it's possible their not targeting us (just an example, I'm sure there targeting all autos).
One reason for the bank pixel move is that they could of used hard coded coordinates for the bank text, but then they could of moved to a function that will center it directly in the center of that window. You never know…

One pixel just seems … And why the text? moving the text with one pixel that were using to detect if were in bank or not, It just seems SO suspicious.

Stupid jagex spys downloading SRL looking through OUR code and changing stuff in runescape, They should just go after the real autoers.. JAVA BOTS!

@Nielsie - Windows should be open source so we could l333ch!

Edit:
Just found a intresting link:
http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~dhoiem/projects/solar/
With source and all, Its C or C++ dunno really.

Hmmm….

Tolerance would be easy :p. (In theory)

You just split the sound up into about 10 parts, and if the majority of those are right, say OK.

The second way, split the sounds up into 10 or more parts, and then change each of those parts' pitch and wavelength. Then see if the majority of those are correct.

There is no way that Jagex will update thier sounds that regularly…. its more effort for them to create dynamic sounds then its worth… it wont make all powerful scripts, it will only aid slightly in telling what process you are doing…

Can you code that in delphi R0b0t?

Sound is played back @ 22.5 kHz. You will only need the first 100 msecs at most, possibly even less (40 msec). The array for comparison will have between 900-2000 elements to search.

nielsie95: how do you store samples? In two's-complement? Do you need a database of sounds? I can provide them if you wish. My Terratec 24/96 allows internal recording. Do you want the sounds in WAV-format or RAW (twos-complement or PCM). Even better would be if someone was to steal the sounds from the client, but I didnt say that.

How would you steal it from the client? You mean using java 0.o

could u make a wav(would that be able to distinguish from sounds?)

http://www-sigproc.eng.cam.ac.uk/~sjg/flute_wav.jpg like that?

If its that hard to write then place a sound praser thing that turns sound into a picture of the Wave and then imbed it in the bottom of SCSS and get scar to find a certain picture?

Nah, I don't have a Delphi compiler. None of them are free. But I do know some Delphi :p. (EDIT: Apparantly FPC supports Object Pascal, aka Delphi.)

But the height of the wave is how loud it is, and its <-> length is how it sounds. (Pretty sure)


Just get WTF to do something, cause if he's not interested, I could try.

well if the wav thing would work then

i dont personally know how to do it, but this video is the finished product of a series of tutorials. and they have a wav makery thing :)

Wavs wont work. Thats a matter of scale. Only when you use a fixed scale does this have the remotest chance of working. Try it yourself in any soundapplication, try reducing/enlarging the magnificationfactor. The waveform fluctuates dramatically.
Better we compare the stream coming out of the soundcard.

From: JuKKa
I think jagex is targetting us very MUCH!

See:
They updated the WHOLE rs looks, changed almost everything, gametabs, chat, we had to change almost everything, and were STILL in beta version, I'd say thats pretty much targetted at us!

Remember when they moved a bank pixel with 1 pixel! ONE PIXEL! just to make us update SRL!

They updated the trade window we had to update AGAIN!

They add MORE randoms all the time!

They changed varroks looks!

They updated gametab(5)!

of course alot more, most of this is probably just to make RS easier to play, But hellalot of work for us!

i think that was to make the game easier for legit players tbh. considering all the bots that acually rape rs updated in less than a week

I'm not sure on this but aren't all the sounds in runescape done in midi? The music for one definitely is. If it is all in midi then you wouldn't need any of this wave analysis stuff and just READ the midi and compare it to a library of the midi in the game. You would get a perfect match every time and it would be reliable. I've done some relatively basic work in midi but if that's how it's done then the whole thing shouldn't be too hard.

If so than that should make this project a lot easier (if we are going to do it)

From: Chrisface
I'm not sure on this but aren't all the sounds in runescape done in midi? The music for one definitely is. If it is all in midi then you wouldn't need any of this wave analysis stuff and just READ the midi and compare it to a library of the midi in the game. You would get a perfect match every time and it would be reliable. I've done some relatively basic work in midi but if that's how it's done then the whole thing shouldn't be too hard.

The music is MIDI (Roland Gen. MIDI) but the sounds are 22.05 kHz Wav, or RAW